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Irish man with valid US work permit held in ICE detention for five months

theguardian.com

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Re: Irish man with valid US work permit held in ICE detention for five months

#61

Post by ylow »

colmmacc wrote: post #38
ylow wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its not so complicated. Not everyone wants a green card. It triggers international taxation, exit taxes if you give it up, etc. If you can maintain a work permit for 20 years, why not? Until life circumstances change sufficiently that it makes sense to have a green card, the balance of pros and cons may not lean towards it.

I don't support this kind of detention, but the case reads like he overstayed his original conditions of entry. According to the court order, he entered the US on the Visa Waiver Program in 2009. He may have a work permit now because anyone can file for an Employment Authorization Document (EAD) through an I-765 while they are applying for a green card through marriage, but there's no indication that he had work perm…

Whether he did really have valid work permits, or not, I have no idea. You seem knowledgeable. But I am just generally mildly frustrated by people online jumping to conclusions assuming malice or criminal intent, while knowing nothing about the US immigration process. It is not surprising that people don't know how US immigration works. Why would one need to unless it is something you have to work with? There are so many misunderstands about H1B, GC, etc.

I do agree that really that the core issue is not with this one particular case, but broadly a pattern of how people are treated, and a failure of due process. People make mistakes. Governments are made up of people who also make mistakes. Process is how you catch mistakes and minimize its occurrence. A failure of due process reduces trust that even fully legal aboveboard immigrants will be treated reasonably and fairly. And that is reducing my confidence that I will be staying in this country long term.

Re: Irish man with valid US work permit held in ICE detention for five months

#62

Post by pbhjpbhj »

Daishiman wrote: post #50
betaby wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But what it is about? What's the end game in detaining lawful workers?

Paving the way for arbitrary detentions and concentration camps.

These are already arbitrary detentions, well unlawful at least (they're purposeful, just not for legal purposes).

The tens of thousands of detainees aren't being put in hotels... they're going to concentration camps; either in USA where they're forced to work (slavery you might term it, as many (most?) have not broken the law, nor been detained legally); or abroad where the regime's intention appears to be that they die.

Re: Irish man with valid US work permit held in ICE detention for five months

#63

Post by [deleted] »

jeffbee wrote: post #53
colmmacc wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't support this kind of detention, but the case reads like he overstayed his original conditions of entry. According to the court order, he entered the US on the Visa Waiver Program in 2009. He may have a work permit now because anyone can file for an Employment Authorization Document (EAD) through an I-765 while they are applying for a green card through marriage, but there's no indication that he had work perm…

This article is about a man whose human rights are being violated. When you argue about whether or not he should have been arrested based of parsing the facts and the law, you are putting yourself on the same side as Stephen Miller. There is no ethical basis to afflict this treatment on anyone, so everything in your post after the first comma shouldn't be there.

[deleted]

Re: Irish man with valid US work permit held in ICE detention for five months

#64

Post by jzebedee »

balozi wrote: post #48

As presented, that dude's story as makes little sense to anyone familiar with the immigration process. There is more to this story, I wish the reporter would just tell it.

If it surprises you, then you haven't paid attention to the blatantly unconstitutional actions of DHS in this administration. The purpose is terror and filling deportation quotas, not enforcing immigration law.

Re: Irish man with valid US work permit held in ICE detention for five months

#65

Post by stackskipton »

ActorNightly wrote: post #32
stackskipton wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My opinion is probably not but this is ultimately a political conversation. The article is extremely light on details but fact he doesn't have a Green Card/Lawful Permanent Resident yet would indicate that at some point of his time in United States, he was illegally present, probably for a while. Sure, he's on path, MAYBE (that's up to immigration courts), to legal status but he's not quite there yet and it's one of…

If someones potential illegal presence justifies ICE to massively overstep any legal due process and break laws, then by definition you are ok if somehow Democrates took over the DHS when they got in power, and used the premise of anti-domestic terrorism to illegally detain any person associated with MAGA for any reason and let them starve/die in prison.

No but is ICE 100% breaking the law or just norms? Immigration law is such a mess and key reason we are here. For past 30 years, a lot of immigration "law" has been Executive Branch keeping a broken system going by just going with vibes. Now we have Executive Branch deciding to 100% change the vibes and system is coming apart in real time.

Reading over court filings, there is collision between two laws. First one is, "Those who marry US Citizens can get Green Card regardless of previous US Immigration violations."

Second one is, VWP admits have no rights. If US decides to deport you, out you go with no further discussion.

Biggest takeaway of Trump immigration actions is Congress has fucked up so bad letting system get to this point.

Re: Irish man with valid US work permit held in ICE detention for five months

#66

Post by ylow »

palmotea wrote: post #52
ylow wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its not so complicated. Not everyone wants a green card. It triggers international taxation, exit taxes if you give it up, etc. If you can maintain a work permit for 20 years, why not? Until life circumstances change sufficiently that it makes sense to have a green card, the balance of pros and cons may not lean towards it.

> If you can maintain a work permit for 20 years, why not? But did he? The OP is mum on the matter about what kind of work permit he had for the 19 years before applying for a green card last year. If he did have some kind of work permit, it sounds like a really strange situation. The article says was running his own business, was he sponsoring himself on a temporary worker visa or something? Given the gaps in the ar…

There is no obligation to provide the public with his life story. Even if provided, few really understand the US immigration process to really comprehend what it means. And finally, does it matter? Even if deportation is fully legally and ethically justified, do the ends justify the means?

Re: Irish man with valid US work permit held in ICE detention for five months

#67

Post by ryan_j_naughton »

SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #55
ryan_j_naughton wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The article is extremely light on details but fact he doesn't have a Green Card/Lawful Permanent Resident yet would indicate that at some point of his time in United States, he was illegally present, probably for a while. That is absolutely false. I know many people who have lived legally in the USA for many many years with valid visas and have intentionally never pursued a green card. Two people come to mind inclu…

I emphasize that I'm not defending the Trump regime, but do you know this friend well enough to be confident that she would tell you if her visa situation didn't check out? It would be extremely hard to stay in the US for 20 uninterrupted years on valid visas without permanent residency. O-1s are theoretically indefinite but require yearly renewal, and all of the other common visas I know of have maximum durations be…

Yes, I am 100% certain of what I said. These individuals have had valid visas in the US and been here for 10-20 years and intentionally have never become green card holders.

One was on a student visa for undergrad and then a student visa for masters for 6 years total (4 for undergrad and 2 for masters), then on a G4 diplomatic visa while working at the World Bank for 5 years, then back to a student visa for 5 years pursuing a PhD, then back to a G4 Diplomatic visa for 6 years while working at the World Bank. This person married an American about 10 years ago and still never pursued a green card out of choice.

Another was on a G4 diplomatic visa while working at the IDB for 3 years, then a student visa for 5 years while pursuing a PhD, then a visa while working at the Federal Reserve for a number of years (not sure of which, but either H1B or J1), and then on a G4 diplomatic visa while working at the IMF.

Of course, these are not your typical situations for the average immigrant. Admittedly, I live in a bit of a bubble surrounded by economists in Washington DC from the World Bank, IMF, IDB, etc who are mostly on G4 diplomatic visas.

My point is it is still possible and one shouldn't presume.

Re: Irish man with valid US work permit held in ICE detention for five months

#68

Post by ryan_j_naughton »

stackskipton wrote: post #57
ryan_j_naughton wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The article is extremely light on details but fact he doesn't have a Green Card/Lawful Permanent Resident yet would indicate that at some point of his time in United States, he was illegally present, probably for a while. That is absolutely false. I know many people who have lived legally in the USA for many many years with valid visas and have intentionally never pursued a green card. Two people come to mind inclu…

From my understanding on this issue, spouses of US citizens are handed a green card after paperwork is shuffled, there is no pursuing it. When discussing this with friends, multiple spouses have pulled out green cards and only newly weds had anything else but green card. She showed her passport with some form attached to it. Also, I did dig up the court filings: https://habeasdockets.org/media/documents/71921787/004_…

>From my understanding on this issue, spouses of US citizens are handed a green card after paperwork is shuffled, there is no pursuing it.

This is incorrect. You do need to pursue it. Just because your friends did pursue it once they were able to, doesn't mean it is automatic. One needs to decide if they want to get their green card or not once they are married to a US citizen.

Re: Irish man with valid US work permit held in ICE detention for five months

#69

Post by casey2 »

daxuak wrote: post #56
betaby wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But what it is about? What's the end game in detaining lawful workers?

Can't you see that they are using immigration questions as an excuse to consolidate power that exceeds immigration enforcement by a large margin? The ability to detain lawful workers or pull people off the street without a warrant from a judge & hold them illegally for a significant duration can become political retaliation or terror tool and a racial profiling vehicle very quickly. And more over, they basically have…

[flagged]

Re: Irish man with valid US work permit held in ICE detention for five months

#70

Post by clipsy »

balozi wrote: post #58
gamesbrainiac wrote: post #44

We have seen many stories like this. Some doubt the authenticity, but what is evident is that these things are happening again and again with impunity. Perhaps you don't think the situation is bad enough, or the details are exaggerated. However, the fact that a man can be pulled of the street despite having legal status should be alarming. You don't need to care about the Irishman, but you should care about justice.

[flagged]

I must have missed the episode where Babu spent months in a concentration camp despite having his paperwork in order and doing nothing wrong.
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