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Tesla ending Models S and X production

cnbc.com

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Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#431

Post by WA »

FL33TW00D wrote: post #388
rswail wrote: post #334

So he milked Tesla for another $2B to subsidize xAI, has dropped the models to 2 (3 and Y), revenue is down, growth is negative, BYD is eating Tesla for lunch, followed by the other CN and KR vehicle companies. He doesn't have FSD, camera only navigation without sensor fusion with LIDAR will fail, the only thing keeping Tesla where it is is the bullshit dispersal field that surrounds Musk.

How can you say camera only navigation won’t work with such finality when humans manage just fine every day! You literally have an existence proof of it working.

Eyes have higher dynamic range and eyes don't freeze below 0°C. You can also put on sunglasses for even more weather-related adjustments.

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#432

Post by 3D30497420 »

raincole wrote: post #425
lnsru wrote: post #355

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The gamble with Cybertruck failed. It’s common sense, that such a vehicle will fail. The successful cars are made for masses and not for niche buyers. Common sense product could be something smaller than Model 3 for Europe and this car would eat Chinese for lunch. Expensive experiment failed, it’s time for consequences. Does Tesla have resources for another car experiment? Will it stay a car company?.. Or it will be…

> The successful cars are made for masses and not for niche buyers. When Tesla got started, full EVs were extremely niche. They were known for their short range and nothing else. Tesla defeated common sense. This is what supports their anti-common-sense stock price.

Is there any indication that they're going to "defeat common sense" again? They're cancelling products, making marginal improvements to old models, alienating their customers, etc.

Tesla as a car company seems dead-set on a continuous downward spiral.

Maybe the switch to robots will pay off and you'll be right. Somehow, I'm skeptical.

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#433

Post by themafia »

al_borland wrote: post #93
bhouston wrote: post #43

Tesla is a meme stock in a similar manner to GME. You cannot bet against them even if they have incredibly unsure future prospectives because there are too many believers who will buy any dips.

That might be a little extreme. Tesla is making electric cars and robots. These are very much things of the future. GameStop is buying and selling used games, which is becoming impossible as consoles keep pushing for digital games. GameStop requires a major shift in their business model to stay relevant, while Tesla just needs to hope the public doesn’t reject the idea of electrics cars out of stubbornness or politic…

> These are very much things of the future.

I thought it was hyperloop. I thought it was suboribital taxis. I thought it was underground taxis. I thought it was self-driving semi trucks. Or was it solar roofs? Or powerwall? Wait weren't we supposed to be on the moon again right now?

He's a bullshitter. Yea, he picks good targets, but he is entirely full of shit. The market just does not reflect this. He should have been golden parachuted onto a yacht years ago.

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#434

Post by sonofhans »

FL33TW00D wrote: post #388
rswail wrote: post #334

So he milked Tesla for another $2B to subsidize xAI, has dropped the models to 2 (3 and Y), revenue is down, growth is negative, BYD is eating Tesla for lunch, followed by the other CN and KR vehicle companies. He doesn't have FSD, camera only navigation without sensor fusion with LIDAR will fail, the only thing keeping Tesla where it is is the bullshit dispersal field that surrounds Musk.

How can you say camera only navigation won’t work with such finality when humans manage just fine every day! You literally have an existence proof of it working.

This is commonly said but trivially falsifiable — a blind human crosses the street better than a Tesla.

Eyesight isn’t the thing. Humans have a persistent mental model of the world, and of the physics that drive it. Our eyes only check in every now and then to keep our model up to date.

Our ears and sense of touch do a lot of work in walking and driving, too. Trying to narrow it all down to vision is silly.

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#435

Post by hobofan »

FL33TW00D wrote: post #388
rswail wrote: post #334

So he milked Tesla for another $2B to subsidize xAI, has dropped the models to 2 (3 and Y), revenue is down, growth is negative, BYD is eating Tesla for lunch, followed by the other CN and KR vehicle companies. He doesn't have FSD, camera only navigation without sensor fusion with LIDAR will fail, the only thing keeping Tesla where it is is the bullshit dispersal field that surrounds Musk.

How can you say camera only navigation won’t work with such finality when humans manage just fine every day! You literally have an existence proof of it working.

~1.2 million global deaths per year due to motor vehicle accidents say otherwise.

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#436

Post by internet_points »

wombatpm wrote: post #28
baron816 wrote: post #12

> converting Fremont factory lines to make Optimus robots I’m very bullish on humanoid robots, but this seems absolutely batshit insane to me. These things are no where near ready for full scale production.

If the can walk and randomly fire teargas and bullets into crowds of protesters they could replace half of ICE right now.

but first they have to demo it to the higher ups https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TYsulVXpgYg

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#437

Post by hashtag-til »

rswail wrote: post #369
lnsru wrote: post #355

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The gamble with Cybertruck failed. It’s common sense, that such a vehicle will fail. The successful cars are made for masses and not for niche buyers. Common sense product could be something smaller than Model 3 for Europe and this car would eat Chinese for lunch. Expensive experiment failed, it’s time for consequences. Does Tesla have resources for another car experiment? Will it stay a car company?.. Or it will be…

BYD already have the Atto 1 (sub AUD30K here) as do other EV manufacturers (eg Nissan Leaf). Tesla could stop spending money on bullshit like the Cybertruck and spend it on vehicles that people actually need/want.

Don't forget Renault 5!

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#438

Post by 3D30497420 »

maelito wrote: post #422
rswail wrote: post #334

So he milked Tesla for another $2B to subsidize xAI, has dropped the models to 2 (3 and Y), revenue is down, growth is negative, BYD is eating Tesla for lunch, followed by the other CN and KR vehicle companies. He doesn't have FSD, camera only navigation without sensor fusion with LIDAR will fail, the only thing keeping Tesla where it is is the bullshit dispersal field that surrounds Musk.

Also in Europe, an old state company called Renault is beating Tesla with the R5.

I just saw an R5 on the street in the bright green. Super cool looking car. There are a whole bunch of promising small EVs coming out in the EU. Hyundai Inster, VW ID.1, Kia EV2, etc.

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#439

Post by Cthulhu_ »

trhway wrote: post #338
sampton wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't remember when was the last S/X refresh. It's nuts they just let it go stale and shut the factory down.

The refresh would need large investment. And it seems that S/X weren't selling that well to warrant such an investment. Just looking around - SV, a key market for Tesla - everybody buys 3 and Y, not S and X. In some sense it seems that 3/Y cannibalized S/X.

While that's true, S/X were considered luxury vehicles, 3/Y mainstream and they far, FAR outsold the S/X. In most cases, volume trumps individual prices.

Of course, that doesn't mean they had to discontinue those lines.

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#440

Post by antonkochubey »

arethuza wrote: post #426
lnsru wrote: post #355

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The gamble with Cybertruck failed. It’s common sense, that such a vehicle will fail. The successful cars are made for masses and not for niche buyers. Common sense product could be something smaller than Model 3 for Europe and this car would eat Chinese for lunch. Expensive experiment failed, it’s time for consequences. Does Tesla have resources for another car experiment? Will it stay a car company?.. Or it will be…

Why would a small Tesla "eat Chinese for lunch" - the brand is tainted (to put it mildly) and the Teslas I've been in didn't seem to have great design or build quality?

because there is still 2012-era belief hanging around many people that Tesla's EV tech is superior to anything else
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