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There's only one Woz, but we can all learn from him

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Re: There's only one Woz, but we can all learn from him

#31

Post by quietbritishjim »

high_na_euv wrote: post #26
nekooooo wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

modern engineering is launching an electron to-do list app that uses 2gb of ram.

Which, at least works relibly across all platforms and devices unlike desktop frameworks? People wouldnt use electron is they had good alternative

Flutter / Dart? It's compiled ahead of time and doesn't use an embedded browser so I'd expect it to be a lot lighter, though I haven't measured.

But the general lack of really cross-platform (desktop + mobile + maybe web) ecosystems is just as much as sign that devs consider multi-gigabyte Electron apps "good enough" as the apps themselves.

Re: There's only one Woz, but we can all learn from him

#32

Post by postalcoder »

omnimus wrote: post #25
postalcoder wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't think of a single person who embodies the spirit of this site more than Woz. dang could replace the guidelines with a picture of Woz and we'd all know what it meant.

Let's not forget url of this site is Ycombinator. As far as i know that is very far from “friendly selfless genius inventor engineer”. It's more like “ambitious finance move fast and break things programmer”.

Woz is a primary figure in one of YC’s essential texts. He has always been revered here as a founder and as a human.

https://www.amazon.com/Founders-Work-Stories-Startups-Early/...

Re: There's only one Woz, but we can all learn from him

#33

Post by tehnub »

ares623 wrote: post #5
bigstrat2003 wrote: post #2

Woz is by far the person in computing history for whom I have the most respect. Dude is an absolute legend , and from everything I have heard is humble and kind on top of his crazy skills. If I could get to the point where I had even 10% of his skill and generosity of spirit, I would consider myself to have done pretty well.

Everyone chooses the wrong Steve to worship.

I worship both thank you very much.

Re: There's only one Woz, but we can all learn from him

#34

Post by p00dles »

Aloha wrote: post #7
ares623 wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everyone chooses the wrong Steve to worship.

If you're an engineer, you should admire Woz, if you're a product manager or marketeer, Jobs. Jobs was a brilliant product manager and marketeer - every bit as brilliant as Woz is an engineer. The truth is, the sharpest engineers struggle to make a marketable consumer product - because they make it for themselves, and while thats quite laudable, however it's generally a tiny market compared to one targeted at normal…

They were both brilliant, but from everything that I've read, Jobs was an ass****, and Woz was the opposite, and that is a huge, huge difference.

The mythologizing of Jobs is the canonical example of people condoning terrible behavior because they think that a person is smart/valuable/talented/etc.

To me this is completely backwards and sets a terrible precedent - that you can act however you want if you get results - especially given how many people idolize and look up to Jobs.

Re: There's only one Woz, but we can all learn from him

#35

Post by flomo »

omnimus wrote: post #25
postalcoder wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't think of a single person who embodies the spirit of this site more than Woz. dang could replace the guidelines with a picture of Woz and we'd all know what it meant.

Let's not forget url of this site is Ycombinator. As far as i know that is very far from “friendly selfless genius inventor engineer”. It's more like “ambitious finance move fast and break things programmer”.

"Tech Cofounder" who gets edged out before the next funding round.

Re: There's only one Woz, but we can all learn from him

#36

Post by appplication »

bigstrat2003 wrote: post #2

Woz is by far the person in computing history for whom I have the most respect. Dude is an absolute legend , and from everything I have heard is humble and kind on top of his crazy skills. If I could get to the point where I had even 10% of his skill and generosity of spirit, I would consider myself to have done pretty well.

I was behind Woz in Heathrow security a few years back. I was taken aback he’d just be in the regular airport security line given he’s probably worth 1B+. I asked him if he was who I thought he was (he was wearing a face mask, but it was printed with a picture of his own face on it so I wasn’t sure). He said yes and asked if I wanted to take a selfie. Very humble dude.

Re: There's only one Woz, but we can all learn from him

#37

Post by microtherion »

p00dles wrote: post #34
Aloha wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're an engineer, you should admire Woz, if you're a product manager or marketeer, Jobs. Jobs was a brilliant product manager and marketeer - every bit as brilliant as Woz is an engineer. The truth is, the sharpest engineers struggle to make a marketable consumer product - because they make it for themselves, and while thats quite laudable, however it's generally a tiny market compared to one targeted at normal…

They were both brilliant, but from everything that I've read, Jobs was an ass****, and Woz was the opposite, and that is a huge, huge difference. The mythologizing of Jobs is the canonical example of people condoning terrible behavior because they think that a person is smart/valuable/talented/etc. To me this is completely backwards and sets a terrible precedent - that you can act however you want if you get results…

The other huge, huge difference is that one of the Steves has demonstrated he was able to build a successful product without the other's assistance.

Re: There's only one Woz, but we can all learn from him

#38

Post by lynx97 »

p00dles wrote: post #34
Aloha wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're an engineer, you should admire Woz, if you're a product manager or marketeer, Jobs. Jobs was a brilliant product manager and marketeer - every bit as brilliant as Woz is an engineer. The truth is, the sharpest engineers struggle to make a marketable consumer product - because they make it for themselves, and while thats quite laudable, however it's generally a tiny market compared to one targeted at normal…

They were both brilliant, but from everything that I've read, Jobs was an ass****, and Woz was the opposite, and that is a huge, huge difference. The mythologizing of Jobs is the canonical example of people condoning terrible behavior because they think that a person is smart/valuable/talented/etc. To me this is completely backwards and sets a terrible precedent - that you can act however you want if you get results…

And still, when it comes to built-in accessibility, Jobs is pretty much famous for his "fuck ROI" statement. He set precedence around 2007, which eventually forced other players like Google and Microsoft to follow. These days, Talkback and Narrator are builtin for both OSes, which is mostly because Apple went there first. This move changed the lifes of a a few million people.

Re: There's only one Woz, but we can all learn from him

#39

Post by hyperhello »

p00dles wrote: post #34
Aloha wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're an engineer, you should admire Woz, if you're a product manager or marketeer, Jobs. Jobs was a brilliant product manager and marketeer - every bit as brilliant as Woz is an engineer. The truth is, the sharpest engineers struggle to make a marketable consumer product - because they make it for themselves, and while thats quite laudable, however it's generally a tiny market compared to one targeted at normal…

They were both brilliant, but from everything that I've read, Jobs was an ass****, and Woz was the opposite, and that is a huge, huge difference. The mythologizing of Jobs is the canonical example of people condoning terrible behavior because they think that a person is smart/valuable/talented/etc. To me this is completely backwards and sets a terrible precedent - that you can act however you want if you get results…

Jobs dealt with people and respected the machines. Woz dealt with machines and respected the people.

Re: There's only one Woz, but we can all learn from him

#40

Post by lynx97 »

high_na_euv wrote: post #26
nekooooo wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

modern engineering is launching an electron to-do list app that uses 2gb of ram.

Which, at least works relibly across all platforms and devices unlike desktop frameworks? People wouldnt use electron is they had good alternative

If you are willing to ignore accessibility, your statement is right.
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