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France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

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Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#141

Post by Braxton1980 »

cmiles8 wrote: post #70

I wish them luck, but while saying folks will drop the dominant apps seems all the rage at the moment people have been saying this for decades with almost no real progress at scale. The only way to accomplish this at scale is to build something that is legit better and let the market decide. Anything else is just principled wishful thinking.

The market makes decisions on quality and pride but it can also use politics, patriotism, religion, and other factors which may not have the greatest impact compared to the first two.

It's possible that both the appeal of home* grown product (patriotism) combined with distaste of the current US government and the tech companies that support it (politics) is enough to push people to switch even if the quality is lower

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#142

Post by mrabcx »

i_love_retros wrote: post #87
cmiles8 wrote: post #70

I wish them luck, but while saying folks will drop the dominant apps seems all the rage at the moment people have been saying this for decades with almost no real progress at scale. The only way to accomplish this at scale is to build something that is legit better and let the market decide. Anything else is just principled wishful thinking.

It's only recently that the united states has become an enemy of the EU though. I'd say there's much more motivation to move to other software and platforms now.

Even during president Obama. the US spied on Merkel's mobile phone.

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#143

Post by nradov »

mamcx wrote: post #109
cmiles8 wrote: post #70

I wish them luck, but while saying folks will drop the dominant apps seems all the rage at the moment people have been saying this for decades with almost no real progress at scale. The only way to accomplish this at scale is to build something that is legit better and let the market decide. Anything else is just principled wishful thinking.

What I wonder is if there will be the pay for enticing developers to build it. I think many of use will love to do this kind of stuff, but is mostly US companies that pay for it. For example, I like to make RDBMs and ERPs kind of software, but here in LATAM is near impossible to get funding for it, how is in Europe?

If they want to build viable competitive products then they'll need to pay for a lot more roles than just developers.

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#144

Post by labcomputer »

cmiles8 wrote: post #70

I wish them luck, but while saying folks will drop the dominant apps seems all the rage at the moment people have been saying this for decades with almost no real progress at scale. The only way to accomplish this at scale is to build something that is legit better and let the market decide. Anything else is just principled wishful thinking.

> I wish them luck, but while saying folks will drop the dominant apps seems all the rage at the moment people have been saying this for decades with almost no real progress at scale.

This feels different.

Up to now there hasn't a really good technical reason to want to switch from, say, Zoom to Teams (or vice versa). You might switch because of network effects: all your friends / coworkers are on the other one. But, video chat is basically a commodity (all work "good enough" and the features are broadly similar) and has been for quite some time.

What's different is that now all (or nearly all) the people contributing to the network effect simultaneously have a reason to want to switch. So the network effect, which was the only thing that was really "sticky" about any of these apps, is gone.

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#145

Post by traceroute66 »

omnimus wrote: post #92
simonebrunozzi wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good luck with OVH. Most EU companies, including this one, offer subpar services compared to their American counterparts.

They are fine. Cloud is a commodity. Hetzner and Bunny are pretty great and i am sure there are many more. The problem is when US decides to ban sales of compute hardware to EU (like they do to China). Then it will be clear who's really in power.

> Then it will be clear who's really in power.

If China closed the door overnight to the US, it would also be clear who's really in power.

The US simply does not have the capacity to replicate the manufacturing domestically.

Even if it were possible, "100% Made in the US" would end up costing at least 20–30% more.

And the US does not have a plan B. Sure there might be India .... one day....years away.

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#146

Post by piva00 »

omnimus wrote: post #92
simonebrunozzi wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good luck with OVH. Most EU companies, including this one, offer subpar services compared to their American counterparts.

They are fine. Cloud is a commodity. Hetzner and Bunny are pretty great and i am sure there are many more. The problem is when US decides to ban sales of compute hardware to EU (like they do to China). Then it will be clear who's really in power.

There'll be a vacuum filled by non-US brands, China is learning and given they'll push to be independent eventually they'll compete with AMD/Intel/Nvidia, Europe has ARM.

The worst thing in the long-term for American hardware makers is for the US to block other countries to purchase from them and having that money invested in alternatives.

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#147

Post by adev_ »

traceroute66 wrote: post #116
nxm wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a software engineer in the US you're not really worrying about access to health care, and have access to public schools as well.

> As a software engineer in the US you're not really worrying about access to health care You're "not really worrying" ... whilst you are in a job. There fixed that for you. As I am sure you are acutely aware US is the home of lay-offs and is generally easy to fire people. If you loose your job in the US it becomes panic stations because you loose that precious employer-paid healthcare overnight. Meanwhile in Europe…

> Meanwhile in Europe ? Take your time job hunting a new job, healthcare is still free.

Currently, healthcare coverage tend to be better in several European countries when you are jobless... because the system try to compensate the fact you do not have income anymore.

Don't get me wrong, their is many 'flaws' in several European healthcare systems and it is far from perfect. but it tends to be more "human" and less "for profit".

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#149

Post by swiftcoder »

cmiles8 wrote: post #124
i_love_retros wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's only recently that the united states has become an enemy of the EU though. I'd say there's much more motivation to move to other software and platforms now.

I don’t think that’s accurate. These issues were always there, but “the sky is falling” rhetoric is all the rage at the moment (in both directions).

> “the sky is falling” rhetoric

It's hardly rhetoric, from the European perspective. The EU is already embroiled in a proxy war against a major power in Ukraine, and are now faced with the prospect of their strongest erstwhile ally moving to annex EU territory.

Simultaneous war on two fronts, where one opponent is deeply embedded in your supply chains, is an existential threat.

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#150

Post by iamEAP »

cmiles8 wrote: post #124
i_love_retros wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's only recently that the united states has become an enemy of the EU though. I'd say there's much more motivation to move to other software and platforms now.

I don’t think that’s accurate. These issues were always there, but “the sky is falling” rhetoric is all the rage at the moment (in both directions).

There were always issues with Nordstream, but the project rapidly imploded only after the war made it all untenable.

Tariffs + coercion via-vis EU tech regulation + Greenland are rapidly making the transatlantic tech status quo untenable.

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