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The world of Japanese snack bars

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Re: The world of Japanese snack bars

#11

Post by mwigdahl »

anonymous908213 wrote: post #3
wolvoleo wrote: post #2

Cool, in Holland snack bars are not homely at all. Some have just little cubbyholes in the wall where you insert a coin and take a croquette from behind a little window (we like buying stuff from behind windows I guess, lol). And if there is staff it's usually a big grumpy guy. And the food is really greasy. It's not a place you go for fun. It's more for quick fix food (though some of it is delicious though bad for y…

I think LGBTQ acceptance in Japan is significantly better than any Western country. The "issue", as it manifests, is of a fundamentally different nature. Not everyone is open to it, of course, and legal marriage is not an option[1]. But while there are many people who are somewhat bigoted, Japan is not an Abrahamic country. Unlike any Christian or Islamic country, the number of people who hate LGBTQ individuals, want…

I'm confused where the assertion about the constitution is coming from. There have been at least 5 years of lower court decisions in Japan stating that lack of same sex marriage is unconstitutional. See the below article noting that the current ban on same sex marriage is due to civil law, not the constitution.

https://apnews.com/article/japan-lgbtq-samesex-marriage-ruli...

Re: The world of Japanese snack bars

#12

Post by retired »

wolvoleo wrote: post #2

Cool, in Holland snack bars are not homely at all. Some have just little cubbyholes in the wall where you insert a coin and take a croquette from behind a little window (we like buying stuff from behind windows I guess, lol). And if there is staff it's usually a big grumpy guy. And the food is really greasy. It's not a place you go for fun. It's more for quick fix food (though some of it is delicious though bad for y…

[dead]

Re: The world of Japanese snack bars

#13

Post by tokioyoyo »

hsbauauvhabzb wrote: post #10
tokioyoyo wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imo, the article is exaggerating quite a bit, and written from a perspective of a tourist, which is fair. Nowadays these bars aren’t hidden or try to be out of sight. Like there’s a whole google maps category just for these type of establishments. But in general, you’d expect what was outlined in the post. From my friends and etc., food might range from pretty bad to average. Might get charged service fee if you’re n…

It’s worth pointing out that there are certainly establishments where tourists aren’t welcome. Ironically I’ve had some gay friends walked from a local only gay bar to the tourists welcome gay bar across the street :-)

Oh definitely. I mean, my neighbourhood has a bar that doesn’t even allow people who don’t live in the area as well. I guess, the gay bars not allowing foreigners is for a different reason, but soft discrimination is very ubiquitous. On the bright side, there are hundreds of thousands of other establishments that will happily take your money.

Re: The world of Japanese snack bars

#14

Post by cosmic_cheese »

anonymous908213 wrote: post #3
wolvoleo wrote: post #2

Cool, in Holland snack bars are not homely at all. Some have just little cubbyholes in the wall where you insert a coin and take a croquette from behind a little window (we like buying stuff from behind windows I guess, lol). And if there is staff it's usually a big grumpy guy. And the food is really greasy. It's not a place you go for fun. It's more for quick fix food (though some of it is delicious though bad for y…

I think LGBTQ acceptance in Japan is significantly better than any Western country. The "issue", as it manifests, is of a fundamentally different nature. Not everyone is open to it, of course, and legal marriage is not an option[1]. But while there are many people who are somewhat bigoted, Japan is not an Abrahamic country. Unlike any Christian or Islamic country, the number of people who hate LGBTQ individuals, want…

While I’m not part of that community myself, I’ve lived in Japan and have known LGBTQ people who are. In the big metros at least, as long as you’re putting forth even a little effort to follow etiquette and you’re not causing problems for others or making a nuisance of yourself, nobody pays you any mind regardless of orientation. Everybody is too busy with their own lives to go poking their noses into the lives of others without due cause.

This is somewhat true of major US metros, but the effect is particularly strong in Tokyo, etc. It’s one of the things I love about living there… being just a number is liberating, even as someone quite boring and mild-mannered.

Re: The world of Japanese snack bars

#15

Post by bigstrat2003 »

wolvoleo wrote: post #2

Cool, in Holland snack bars are not homely at all. Some have just little cubbyholes in the wall where you insert a coin and take a croquette from behind a little window (we like buying stuff from behind windows I guess, lol). And if there is staff it's usually a big grumpy guy. And the food is really greasy. It's not a place you go for fun. It's more for quick fix food (though some of it is delicious though bad for y…

> tattoos are frowned upon

My understanding is that this isn't about tattoos per se, but that historically only yakuza would have them. So it's more about not wanting to deal with criminals than not liking tattoos in and of themselves.

Re: The world of Japanese snack bars

#16

Post by anonymous908213 »

mwigdahl wrote: post #11
anonymous908213 wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think LGBTQ acceptance in Japan is significantly better than any Western country. The "issue", as it manifests, is of a fundamentally different nature. Not everyone is open to it, of course, and legal marriage is not an option[1]. But while there are many people who are somewhat bigoted, Japan is not an Abrahamic country. Unlike any Christian or Islamic country, the number of people who hate LGBTQ individuals, want…

I'm confused where the assertion about the constitution is coming from. There have been at least 5 years of lower court decisions in Japan stating that lack of same sex marriage is unconstitutional. See the below article noting that the current ban on same sex marriage is due to civil law, not the constitution. https://apnews.com/article/japan-lgbtq-samesex-marriage-ruli...

I mean, lower courts don't mean a lot in the grand scheme of things, for better or worse. It seems clear that the lower courts are trying to legislate from the bench in service of a moral good. The constitution is extremely unambiguous about this:

  第二十四条

  婚姻は、両性の合意のみに基いて成立し、夫婦が同等の権利を有することを基本として、相互の協力により、維持されなければならない。
With "両性" unambiguously meaning "both sexes" and "夫婦" unambiguously meaning "husband and wife".

Re: The world of Japanese snack bars

#17

Post by fjdjshsh »

hsbauauvhabzb wrote: post #10
tokioyoyo wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imo, the article is exaggerating quite a bit, and written from a perspective of a tourist, which is fair. Nowadays these bars aren’t hidden or try to be out of sight. Like there’s a whole google maps category just for these type of establishments. But in general, you’d expect what was outlined in the post. From my friends and etc., food might range from pretty bad to average. Might get charged service fee if you’re n…

It’s worth pointing out that there are certainly establishments where tourists aren’t welcome. Ironically I’ve had some gay friends walked from a local only gay bar to the tourists welcome gay bar across the street :-)

Not a local, but in my experience this is due to tourists not being able to speak Japanese, which makes the people working in a place very uncomfortable ("will this person follow the rules? How can I do proper service if I can't communicate?"). A 大丈夫、少し日本語をしゃべります (it's ok, I speak a bit of japanese) has been enough to open the doors for me.

That being said, they do have issues with some nationalities. For example, the average American is way too loud for the average japanese place. Even if they think they are being polite, they just talk too loud and too much for japanese sensibilities.

Re: The world of Japanese snack bars

#18

Post by NalNezumi »

hsbauauvhabzb wrote: post #7
anonymous908213 wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think LGBTQ acceptance in Japan is significantly better than any Western country. The "issue", as it manifests, is of a fundamentally different nature. Not everyone is open to it, of course, and legal marriage is not an option[1]. But while there are many people who are somewhat bigoted, Japan is not an Abrahamic country. Unlike any Christian or Islamic country, the number of people who hate LGBTQ individuals, want…

I travelled there with my same sex partner. We had zero issues in a single bed hotel room, and there were plenty of gay bars. We did find the cover charge difference for gays vs straights amusing (where gay entry was cheaper). I’m sure there are social issues, a local bartender told us they had linguistic limitations that acted as sort of barriers to expression, and I’m sure there are issues for gay youth, but as a w…

I can't find the article, but I read an article about the experience of an LGBTQ Californian that moved to Tokyo found it more friendly than US (including progressive state).

The point was that in US LGBTQ is politicized. If you tell people about it, you have to either defend it (vs conservatives) or explain it (vs progressives, but with encouragement). Both got very exhausting fast for the person, even the well intentioned ones.

In Japan, the general reaction from coworkers to landlords was へー, そうなんだ。 (oh ok, cool.) no follow up questions or prodding.

Vast majority don't care enough about your private sexual preferences. (goodness sake people it's the country of Hentai, people there really don't fucking care about your private presences) They do, however, care when you politicize it (making it their issue)

The trend is slow but good looking for LGBTQ right in Japan. It won't move forward like people expect in the west. I'd guess one or two more generations. The only risk factor I see is the west. The polarization and politization of the issue, seen from Japan, is making the conservative wings more cautious about the topic.

Either case, Shinjuku 2chome will be a very welcoming place. My gay friend from Sweden love that place more than any supposed to be gay friendly place in Europe

Re: The world of Japanese snack bars

#19

Post by embedding-shape »

charcircuit wrote: post #4

It's not a secret. They are public businesses and many are on Google Maps.

Just as a helpful tip: "inside the secret world" is an colloquial term for just "here's an inside peek at something not so widely known", not that it's literally "secret" and hidden.

Re: The world of Japanese snack bars

#20

Post by tkgally »

The article should have at least mentioned the contradiction between publicizing places whose business model is based on meaningful conversation and repeat customers to foreign tourists, who generally do not speak the local language and who are typically in the country for only a week or two.
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