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Our approach to age prediction

openai.com

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Re: Our approach to age prediction

#51

Post by pixl97 »

throwaway132448 wrote: post #40
sho_hn wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm an engineer working on safety-critical systems and have to live with that responsibility every day. When I read the chat logs of the first teenager who committed suicide with the help and encouragement of ChatGPT I was immediately thinking about ways that could be avoided that make sense in the product. I want companies like OpenAI to have the same reaction and try things. I'm just glad they are. I'm also fully a…

Maybe we don’t all need saving from ourselves. Maybe we need to grow up and have some personal responsibility. As someone who is happy to do that, seeing personal freedom endlessly slashed in the name of safety is tiresome. My feelings have absolutely nothing to do with censorship. That’s just an easy straw man for you to try and dismiss my point of view, because you’re scared of not feeling safe.

Cool, I'd like you to make a commercial system you sell access to and ensure that it is unsafe. I'll represent the injured and we'll own all your corporate assets, and like will pierce the corporate veil due to your wonton behavior.

Re: Our approach to age prediction

#52

Post by seneca »

sonofhans wrote: post #36
sho_hn wrote: post #8

I think this is good. I've been very aggressive toward OpenAI on here about parental controls and youth protection, and I have to say the recent work is definitely more than I expected out of them.

This is a thoughtful response and deserves discussion. Yes, certainly, OpenAI might get your age wrong. Yes, certainly, they’re signaling to advertisers. But consider OPs point — ChatGPT has become a safety-critical system. It is a tool capable of pushing a human towards terrible actions, and there are documented cases of it doing this. In that context, what is the responsibility of OpenAI to keep their product away…

> ChatGPT has become a safety-critical system.

It's really really not. "Safety-critical system" has a meaning, and a chat bot doesn't qualify. Treating the whole world as if it needs to be wrapped in bubble-wrap is extremely unhealthy and it generally just used as an excuse for creeping authoritarianism.

Re: Our approach to age prediction

#54

Post by heliumtera »

jampa wrote: post #15

I imagine they're building this system with the goal of extracting user demographics (age, sex, income) from chat conversations to improve advertising monetization. This seems to be a side project of their goal and a good way to calibrate the future ad system predictions.

safe to say everything in existence is created to extract user demographics. it was never about you finding information, this trillion market exists to find you. it was never about you summarizing information getting around advertisement, it is about profiling you.

this trillion market is not about empowering users to style their pages more quickly, heh

Re: Our approach to age prediction

#55

Post by samename »

sho_hn wrote: post #8

I think this is good. I've been very aggressive toward OpenAI on here about parental controls and youth protection, and I have to say the recent work is definitely more than I expected out of them.

Interesting. Do you believe OpenAI has earned user trust and will be good stewards of the enhanced data (biometric, demographic, etc) they are collecting?

To me, this feels nefarious with the recent push into advertising. Not only are people dating these chat bots, but they are more trusting of these AI systems than people in their own life. Now, OpenAI is using this "relationship" to influence user's buying behavior.

Re: Our approach to age prediction

#56

Post by footy »

sho_hn wrote: post #17
DarkNova6 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that"

I'm an engineer working on safety-critical systems and have to live with that responsibility every day. When I read the chat logs of the first teenager who committed suicide with the help and encouragement of ChatGPT I was immediately thinking about ways that could be avoided that make sense in the product. I want companies like OpenAI to have the same reaction and try things. I'm just glad they are. I'm also fully a…

I am against companies doing age verification like this due to the surveillance effects, but I agree with you that the censorship angle is not a good one.

I suppose mainly because I don't think a non-minor committing suicide with ChatGPT's help and encouragement matters less than a minor doing so. I honestly thing the problem is the user interface for GPT being a chat. I think it has a psychological effect that you can talk to ChatGPT the same way you can talk to Emily from school. I don't think this is a solvable problem if OpenAI wants this to be their main product (and obviously they do).

Re: Our approach to age prediction

#57

Post by throwaway132448 »

sho_hn wrote: post #46
throwaway132448 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe we don’t all need saving from ourselves. Maybe we need to grow up and have some personal responsibility. As someone who is happy to do that, seeing personal freedom endlessly slashed in the name of safety is tiresome. My feelings have absolutely nothing to do with censorship. That’s just an easy straw man for you to try and dismiss my point of view, because you’re scared of not feeling safe.

I'm not under 18. I assume you aren't either.

I was addressing your own (supposedly) safety-critical work, how you’ve used that to justify other work in the name of safety more broadly, and how you’ve placed yourself on a pedestal with your experience, to convince yourself that comments by others on the necessity of such safety are less qualified.

Re: Our approach to age prediction

#59

Post by threetonesun »

Imustaskforhelp wrote: post #49
qoez wrote: post #31

Does regulators really care about a predicted age? I feel like they require hard proof of being above age to show explicit content. The only ones that care about predicted age is advertisers.

It's not much for the regulators as much as its for the advertisers. At this point, just use gemini (yes its google and has its issues if you need SOTA) or I have recently been trying out more and more chat.z.ai for simple text issues (like hey can you fix this docker issue etc.) and I feel like chat.z.ai is pretty good plus open source models (honestly chat.z.ai feels pretty SOTA to me)

Kagi's Assistant is the most useful tool I've found as far as searching goes, and occasionally simple codegen. Let's you use a wide variety of models and isn't tracking me.

Re: Our approach to age prediction

#60

Post by kube-system »

jampa wrote: post #15

I imagine they're building this system with the goal of extracting user demographics (age, sex, income) from chat conversations to improve advertising monetization. This seems to be a side project of their goal and a good way to calibrate the future ad system predictions.

I think they're quite explicitly saying they already can determine your demographics from your chats. Which is almost certainly true for most users.
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