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Apple testing new App Store design that blurs the line between ads and results

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Re: Apple testing new App Store design that blurs the line between ads and results

#421

Post by TheDong »

podgorniy wrote: post #386
wvh wrote: post #370

I feel these practices contribute to the post-truth society where a user looks for a fact and gets a paid-for opinion shoved in the face instead. It should be easy for the user to discern the factual relevance of search query results, and it does not bode well if the provider of the search functionality is in on the deceit.

> It should be easy for the user to discern the factual relevance of search query results Is it even possible to structure incentives in such way that this happens? _Without totalitarian dictatorship methods_ if possible please.

The only reason that these company mark ads at all are due to consumer protection laws about undisclosed sponsored content.

If stronger consumer protection laws are "totalitarian dictatorship methods", then no, there is no path. If we aren't allowed to have laws and regulation, only unregulated capitalism, by definition capital makes right, and so apple having more money than you means you have no recourse.

Any way to structure incentives (like "we will all agree to only buy from companies that don't act unfairly") is the same as creating an ad-hoc government regulation.

Re: Apple testing new App Store design that blurs the line between ads and results

#422

Post by spacecadet »

mdasen wrote: post #21

This is what basically everyone else has done over the past decade. Google used to put a different background behind ads in its search ( https://www.fsedigital.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/11/Google... ). It made it really easy to tell what was an ad and skip over it quickly. Now it's a lot harder to quickly notice what's an ad and what isn't. Sites used to have banner ads. Now they show posts that look exactly like t…

This is the eventual evolution of any platform that sells ads or sponsored content. Who is paying the bills? App developers and their desire to bring on customers...

Re: Apple testing new App Store design that blurs the line between ads and results

#423

Post by tshaddox »

rgovostes wrote: post #104

This makes no difference, because I can’t remember the last time I installed an app other than for the occasional airline. From 2008-12 it was genuinely exciting to see what new apps were being released every day. Mobile games from that era had cultural impact. I bought $2 apps without a thought. But Apple incentivized monetization above all else and killed that excitement. Now you can’t find a tip calculator that do…

Yep. I wish they would just completely get rid of the concept of a self-serve App Store and go fully into the video game console model where there’s a much smaller library of much more strongly vetted third party software available. It would drastically increase the average user’s experience with iPhone software quality, and it might even help them with all the complaints about not allowing side loaded apps (notice how video game consoles rarely seem to deal with that complaint).

Re: Apple testing new App Store design that blurs the line between ads and results

#424

Post by k2enemy »

MaysonL wrote: post #160
k2enemy wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I could not agree more. It probably doesn't help that I just spend an hour trying to figure out how to update to 18.7.3 on my iphone. It turns out you can't. The only way to get security updates now is to upgrade to iOS 26. Apple no longer supports security updates to old major versions if the device is capable of running the new major release. Apple is no longer making choices that benefit customers, but ones that b…

18.7.3 is still available for download via a paid developer account, not sure about a free one.

Thanks, I gave it a try. I see the download, but it isn't signed for newer iphones. Only ones that don't support iOS 26. So frustrating. I'm on a 12 mini and people report that 26 runs horribly on it.

Re: Apple testing new App Store design that blurs the line between ads and results

#425

Post by olyjohn »

MonkeyClub wrote: post #368
torben-friis wrote: post #311

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It's shocking that Apple hasn't done this trick yet when everyone else started doing it years ago. They sell a walled garden. If shit gets inside the walls, we might as well come out. I’m not willing to pay the apple tax any longer. Let the ad sellers pay if they’re the main costumers.

> I’m not willing to pay the apple tax any longer. Problem here is that when you decide you no longer wish to pay the tax and want to exit the walled garden, you discover that there's a heap of functionality and convenience you'll have to let go, and add complexity and cost to your setup. I actively avoided relying on iCloud even when it was the sane option, but many people that will feel like the walled garden is no…

Oh no I lost my conveniences! Cry me a river. Are people really so weak we can't even give up little things to show these fucking tech companies we don't like what they are doing?

Re: Apple testing new App Store design that blurs the line between ads and results

#426

Post by css_apologist »

dymk wrote: post #409
torben-friis wrote: post #311

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It's shocking that Apple hasn't done this trick yet when everyone else started doing it years ago. They sell a walled garden. If shit gets inside the walls, we might as well come out. I’m not willing to pay the apple tax any longer. Let the ad sellers pay if they’re the main costumers.

It’s still better than the alternatives

Once we grow up as a nation and legalize competing app stores on native Android and iOS you can try to make this point

However, the alternatives are currently illegal, so your point doesn't hold

Re: Apple testing new App Store design that blurs the line between ads and results

#427

Post by olyjohn »

technothrasher wrote: post #337
socalgal2 wrote: post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not trying to excuse Amazon but you do know what like, super markets, best buy etc, take ad money (promotional money?) from suppliers who pay for placement. That Samsung TV at the front being pushed at you, that's effectively ad money Samsung paid to have their TVs put at the front of the store. Those cans of Coke stacked at the end of the isle or piled up near the entrance at your super market? Coke paid to have…

When I owned a liquor store, the cigarette sales reps would all fall over themselves givings us free stuff, including straight cash, to place their cigarettes more prominently than the other brands. This would last for about a week or two until the other brand's rep would notice and up the ante. > Those cans of Coke stacked at the end of the isle or piled up near the entrance at your super market? Coke paid to have t…

Someone's gotta explain why the tortillas are always on the end caps...

Re: Apple testing new App Store design that blurs the line between ads and results

#428

Post by lorddumpy »

PlatoIsADisease wrote: post #7

Wont make a difference. People are already in the Walled Prison and moms/teens/lower-middle class people are shamed for not being able to afford the $50/mo to buy an iphone. They had numerous privacy and security issues that caused literal deaths of VIPs. Their quality is always 2nd best if we are being generous. If they haven't switched yet, its not going to happen. Apple knows this. Late users are always punished l…

I am switching next week when my new phone gets in. Between Siri, vanilla bugs, ios 26, and questionable design decisions, I'm going to try Android. I will say my 13 Pro is a beautiful piece of hardware but the software shortcomings are beginning to pile.

Re: Apple testing new App Store design that blurs the line between ads and results

#429

Post by dymk »

css_apologist wrote: post #426
dymk wrote: post #409

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s still better than the alternatives

Once we grow up as a nation and legalize competing app stores on native Android and iOS you can try to make this point However, the alternatives are currently illegal, so your point doesn't hold

Then they're not really alternatives, are they?

Re: Apple testing new App Store design that blurs the line between ads and results

#430

Post by disgruntledphd2 »

tartoran wrote: post #109
bool3max wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What’s interesting to me is that no matter how “hidden” the AD indicator may be, my brain always seems to very quickly train itself to swiftly skip such posts when scrolling/browsing. Or I could simply be another clueless victim of advertising. If only I could know the number of sponsored posts I never consciously acknowledge and am influenced by on the daily.

If the vast majority of people recognized ads and skipped them as more technically minded people do, they'd either not do that or step up a notch and make them even harder to spot. The reality is that these dark patterns do work for a large part of the users. We're the lucky few who can stay away though it is taxing and tiring.

> If the vast majority of people recognized ads and skipped them as more technically minded people do

People definitely do this. When I worked for a large social media company, we almost always had ads in position 2. People noticeably (in the aggregate data) spent less time with this position in the viewport.

But honestly, most people are just extra impressions/revenue for most advertisers, there's a much smaller number of people who drive ~all of the conversions.

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