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"Anyone else out there vibe circuit-building?"

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Re: "Anyone else out there vibe circuit-building?"

#11

Post by mikeayles »

Been working on this exact problem for a while now. The core issue isn't that LLMs are bad at circuits, it's that we're asking them to do novel design when they should be doing selection and integration.

My project (https://phaestus.app/blog) takes a different approach: pre-validated circuit blocks on a fixed 12.7mm grid with standardized bus structures. The LLM picks which blocks you need and where they go, but the actual circuit design was done by humans and tested. No hallucinated resistor values, no creative interpretations of datasheets.

It's the same insight that made software dependencies work. You don't ask ChatGPT to write you a JSON parser from scratch, you ask it which library to use. Hardware should work the same way.

Still WIP and the block library needs expanding, but the constraint-based approach means outputs are manufacturable by construction rather than "probably fine, let's see what catches fire."

Re: "Anyone else out there vibe circuit-building?"

#12

Post by bob1029 »

What would stop us from using something like LTspice to validate the circuit before risking physical components?

This seems ~identical to the situation where we can use a compiler or parser to return syntax errors to the agent in a feedback loop.

I don't know exactly what the tool calling surface would look like, but I feel like this could work.

Re: "Anyone else out there vibe circuit-building?"

#13

Post by __MatrixMan__ »

JKCalhoun wrote: post #7

Why, yes I am. I know Ben is having some fun, perhaps making a valid point, with the burning component on the breadboard. I think it does underscore a difference between software vibing and hardware vibing—crash vs. fire. But in fact vibe-breadboarding has drawn me deeper into the electronics hobby. I have learned more about op-amps and analog computing in the past two months in large part thanks to Gemini and ChatGP…

Know the risks, prepare for them, get a little burned now and then, have fun... sounds like a recipe for learning to me.

Re: "Anyone else out there vibe circuit-building?"

#15

Post by nospice »

JKCalhoun wrote: post #7

Why, yes I am. I know Ben is having some fun, perhaps making a valid point, with the burning component on the breadboard. I think it does underscore a difference between software vibing and hardware vibing—crash vs. fire. But in fact vibe-breadboarding has drawn me deeper into the electronics hobby. I have learned more about op-amps and analog computing in the past two months in large part thanks to Gemini and ChatGP…

Both Gemini and ChatGPT have a pretty comically wrong knowledge of op-amps. They usually recommend outdated chips and are confused about circuit topologies. I was looking at this last week and it hasn't changed. I asked them to suggest and evaluate microphone circuits and they were just bad. I would really, really recommend reading some human-written text if you're learning about that.

I can't think of any reason why you'd want to use Schottky diodes to protect op-amp inputs. They have high leakage currents and poor surge capabilities. Most op-amps have internal protection diodes, and if you need some extra ESD or overvoltage protection, a Schottky diode probably isn't the way.

I'm not taking an anti-LLM view here. I think they are useful in some fields and are getting better. But in this particular instance, there's a breadth of excellent learning resources and the one you've chosen isn't good.

Re: "Anyone else out there vibe circuit-building?"

#16

Post by bradfa »

If you know what you're doing with electronics design, I've found that leveraging an LLM to help come up with ideas, layout block diagrams, and find parts can be super useful. Integrating Digi-Key or Mouser API support for finding parts pricing and inventory is also super handy. Using the distributor APIs can also allow you to perform natural language search which isn't possible (or isn't easy) through the distributor websites as the LLM can quickly download the datasheet and read it as part of its searching operation to verify if a part should be considered given your requirements.

Re: "Anyone else out there vibe circuit-building?"

#18

Post by JKCalhoun »

__MatrixMan__ wrote: post #13
JKCalhoun wrote: post #7

Why, yes I am. I know Ben is having some fun, perhaps making a valid point, with the burning component on the breadboard. I think it does underscore a difference between software vibing and hardware vibing—crash vs. fire. But in fact vibe-breadboarding has drawn me deeper into the electronics hobby. I have learned more about op-amps and analog computing in the past two months in large part thanks to Gemini and ChatGP…

Know the risks, prepare for them, get a little burned now and then, have fun... sounds like a recipe for learning to me.

Sometimes sarcasm is so subtle…

Irrespective, "letting the magic smoke out" has been a part of the electronic hobbyist's vernacular long before vibe-breadboarding. (Been there many times.)

Re: "Anyone else out there vibe circuit-building?"

#19

Post by bradfa »

1970-01-01 wrote: post #9

This brings up a much larger discussion. How bad are LLMs at engineering? Would you trust one to build a high voltage circuit? How about a bridge?

I don't trust an LLM to write software for me without human verification, but it's not like it's that hard to verify what it writes if you understand how to write code yourself. I expect even when an LLM can layout a high voltage circuit or design a bridge that most organizations who carry liability would still be sure to audit the design with a set or two of intelligent and trained human eyes.

Re: "Anyone else out there vibe circuit-building?"

#20

Post by cbdevidal »

JKCalhoun wrote: post #7

Why, yes I am. I know Ben is having some fun, perhaps making a valid point, with the burning component on the breadboard. I think it does underscore a difference between software vibing and hardware vibing—crash vs. fire. But in fact vibe-breadboarding has drawn me deeper into the electronics hobby. I have learned more about op-amps and analog computing in the past two months in large part thanks to Gemini and ChatGP…

Just this morning I was vibing with Gemini to make a battery-powered stove monitor to sell that I might call "Yes I turned off the stupid stove" :-)

Gemini was suggesting the circuit design and of course I'd do the final work myself, but I find vibe-circuit-building to be quite valuable.

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