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Prediction: Microsoft will eventually ship a Windows-themed Linux distro

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Re: Prediction: Microsoft will eventually ship a Windows-themed Linux distro

#121

Post by stackskipton »

asdff wrote: post #38
stackskipton wrote: post #31

Checks the bio Ahh, Zero Sysadmin experience so does not know about amount of legacy garbage being run at many companies and Enterprises. Amount of software running on .Net Framework is mind boggling. If there is not 100% compatibility with .Net Framework on Windows running on Linux, forget it. I know of a company still using Visual FoxPro in 2020 and it was still being maintained. Just like COBOL, across insane amou…

You can run .net over wine no?

Some .Net Framework might be fine but unless it promises 100% all .Net calls, including ones using "unsupported APIs" or other insane stuff, works, there will be plenty of very unhappy Windows customers.

Re: Prediction: Microsoft will eventually ship a Windows-themed Linux distro

#122

Post by keyle »

daviddever23box wrote: post #107
keyle wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a good point. The kernel stuff of Windows isn't really the problem. I've been on macOS for eons, but I still hope that some day, someone at microsoft will have the balls to make a Windows Redux. Which is just Windows 7 with a coat of paint; and less stuff, installable separately; geared towards speed and not stuffings.

ReactOS has entered the chat.

Yes that project unfortunately just doesn't seem to get there, or is terrible at marketing itself.

Re: Prediction: Microsoft will eventually ship a Windows-themed Linux distro

#123

Post by LexiMax »

Fwirt wrote: post #114
wackget wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My experience of Linux (and Mac OS) has been the opposite; they are extremely painful to make usable. Yes, I have to disable a lot of stuff to get Windows the way I like it. But that's still exponentially easier than having to add, install, or perhaps even buy a lot of stuff to maybe get Linux/Mac to behave kind of how I want it to.

Having been a longtime Windows user, an on/off Linux desktop user, and now primarily a Mac user, I really think it's just what you're used to. Each desktop environment has its own strengths and weaknesses, and trying to bend one to be like the other is going to end in frustration. The userland of each OS is sufficiently different that different desktop metaphors break in different ways when you try to port them. MacO…

> Having been a longtime Windows user, an on/off Linux desktop user, and now primarily a Mac user, I really think it's just what you're used to

I've also used all three OS's in anger and largely agree.

I like to call that sort of attitude YOSPOS, named after one of the technology-oriented subforums on Something Awful. It stands for "Your Operating System is a Piece Of Shit."

Which OS? Your OS, whichever one (the royal) You happen to be using at the time. They all stink for different reasons, and it's just a matter of which OS's annoyances you decide to put up with.

That said, good lord, Windows 11 has been rough. I actually don't mind most of the UI changes, but the AI psychosis and the general lack of stability has made Windows 11 one of the only versions of Windows I can remember that started mediocre and kept getting worse with updates instead of better.

Re: Prediction: Microsoft will eventually ship a Windows-themed Linux distro

#124

Post by voidfunc »

Microsoft already has a Linux, it is known as Azure Linux or cbl-mariner depending on the variant. It is not setup for being a general purpose OS. It is what we are supposed to use as our OS for Linux based services in Azure.

I just dont buy what the author is selling. Windows NT kernel is _good_. The userland is what is fucked and hated by many. But also Windows is more than just an OS it is an entire enterprise ecosystem. Stuff like Active Directory is a big deal and intimately intertwined with Windows.

Also, if there was a push to replace Windows NT with Linux you would have heard about it nnow. That is going to be a huge project and almost impossible to keep under wraps and without leaks. Microsoft isnt Apple when it comes to leak secrecy.

Re: Prediction: Microsoft will eventually ship a Windows-themed Linux distro

#125

Post by Uvix »

nomdep wrote: post #82

I think he might be right The massive amount of legacy .NET and older software still running in many enterprises isn’t a problem, but a huge business opportunity. My prediction is that Microsoft will push hard their “Azure Virtual Desktop” product: remote, virtualized Windows instances hosted on their own servers to these enterprises. In this model, the operating system running on the client devices will becomes larg…

But in that case, Microsoft still has to support and maintain the Windows OS running within the Azure Virtual Desktop. If they're doing that, why not support it on the end user compute as well, and get that sweet sweet recurring Windows license revenue from businesses?

Re: Prediction: Microsoft will eventually ship a Windows-themed Linux distro

#126

Post by scott01 »

AndyKelley wrote: post #36

In effort to imagine something even funnier: ReactOS developers use Copilot to extract and copyright launder Windows source code, and then rather than fight it, Microsoft starts shipping ReactOS.

But if legal system decides the output of LLMs belongs to the entity that trained it, and given that Copilot has the capability to generate any possible code, that means Microsoft, via Copilot, will own copyright to all possible code in the universe, which will naturally allow Microsoft to acquire ReactOS.

Re: Prediction: Microsoft will eventually ship a Windows-themed Linux distro

#127

Post by bitwize »

Eric S. Raymond wrote the same erotic fanfic a few years back just before his blog went kaputski (http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=8764). It won't happen, because the NT kernel is a massive improvement in architecture over Linux or any conventional Unix—and Microsoft has proven, with WSL1 and 2, that they can achieve Linux compatibility while still basing everything on the NT kernel. Switching the Windows ecosystem to the Linux kernel is harder, because Hyrum's Law applies and some Windows binaries operate by using NT syscalls directly, bypassing msvcrt and Win32. And Windows has something Linux doesn't have, and it would take enormous effort for it to get: a sane driver model. It is possible to ship a device with a binary Windows driver and have it Just Work, even on later versions of Windows; this is just not possible under Linux.

The future for Microsoft is doubling down on "security" by making the PC as a platform more restricted: requiring a signed boot path mandatory from power on down through the application level code. They can convince OEMs that this is necessary for compliance with internet safety laws in certain countries, some of which require safety checks (like age verification) even on end-user equipment. It looks to me like some of their moves point in this direction: Windows 11 requires TPM 2.0 because the plan is for Windows 12 to be a completely closed platform. Xbox is being phased out because the thing that distinguishes an Xbox from a cut-down PC—the locked-down nature of the platform—is something Microsoft intends to bring to all PCs with Pluton.

Re: Prediction: Microsoft will eventually ship a Windows-themed Linux distro

#128

Post by codedokode »

tombert wrote: post #104
hougaard wrote: post #26

Because the "UX" of Windows sucks, Microsoft will switch the "Kernel" to Linux? I don't get the argument. There are parts of Windows I don't like, so I have chosen a 3rd-party (often open-source) replacement. The exact same process as I do on Linux. I don't see why I have to switch to Linux to have that freedom. (and to be honest, I don't care where the taskbar is)

Yeah, I was about to say. The NT kernel isn’t bad at all; it’s arguably better than Linux. It’s just that an OS is more than a kernel, and pretty much all the other crap in Windows is terrible. Honestly, what I would like them to do is make/support a modern Copy on Write filesystem so that System Restore actually works , and so that it’s easy to roll back when Windows Update borks your PC. You don’t need Linux for ei…

No, both NT and Linux kernels are bad because they are monolithic and not sandboxing-first.

Re: Prediction: Microsoft will eventually ship a Windows-themed Linux distro

#129

Post by rationalist »

thunderbong wrote: post #110
OsrsNeedsf2P wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Took me about 2 minutes to replicate on KDE Plasma[0][1]. I have a lot more things in my taskbar that I don't want to remove for this test, so it looks a little more crammed up. [0] https://i.imgur.com/esNjPNg.png [1] I didn't try to replicate it perfectly; things like smaller icons/etc are settings but cba

It's not the same, though. The parent comment shows two rows of different types - the upper row consists of the taskbar, and the lower row has the quick launch icons, drive links, and a music bar. Quite an interesting layout, imho.

I have a feeling that is due to several programs. One of which I recognize in the systray: 7+ Taskbar Tweaker

https://ramensoftware.com/7-taskbar-tweaker

Re: Prediction: Microsoft will eventually ship a Windows-themed Linux distro

#130

Post by wilsonnb3 »

tombert wrote: post #104
hougaard wrote: post #26

Because the "UX" of Windows sucks, Microsoft will switch the "Kernel" to Linux? I don't get the argument. There are parts of Windows I don't like, so I have chosen a 3rd-party (often open-source) replacement. The exact same process as I do on Linux. I don't see why I have to switch to Linux to have that freedom. (and to be honest, I don't care where the taskbar is)

Yeah, I was about to say. The NT kernel isn’t bad at all; it’s arguably better than Linux. It’s just that an OS is more than a kernel, and pretty much all the other crap in Windows is terrible. Honestly, what I would like them to do is make/support a modern Copy on Write filesystem so that System Restore actually works , and so that it’s easy to roll back when Windows Update borks your PC. You don’t need Linux for ei…

They already have a modern copy on write file system (ReFS), you just can’t use it on desktop Windows for some reason
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