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The Palantir app helping ICE raids in Minneapolis

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Re: The Palantir app helping ICE raids in Minneapolis

#381
post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm going to defend the HN "no politics" rule here. The reason "no politics" zones exist is because there are enough people going out of their way to shout at everybody, everywhere, in every corner of the internet and enough people are tired of it that they flock to...no politics zones. In real life, a person like that confronts you...you remove yourself from the situation, because that person who can't stop shouting…

I think what op is getting at is that "no politics" rule is what allowed the frog to boil. So banning political discussion is political in and of itself. I'd agree with your no politics preference if we were in a functioning society that wasn't actively spiralling towards fascism. I recognize that this line is blurry, and that's exactly the reason why no politics zones exist, there is always someone yelling about fas…

> I think what op is getting at is that "no politics" rule is what allowed the frog to boil.

But this simply isn't the case. The fact that "no politics" zones exist is a response to the fact that politics is everywhere else.

People here aren't blissfully unaware, they're just tired of it and many realize that arguing about it on the internet won't accomplish anything other than wasting time. As I sit here writing this, I'm thinking that I'm probably wasting my time.

We all have this idea in our head that if people are confronted with enough evidence, they'll change their minds. But that doesn't happen. People rationalize.

My goodness, people attack RFK Jr non-stop simply because he's part of the Trump administration and all he's done for his entire life is try to help the country be healthier. Every point he's made, every plan he's had and every policy he has advocated for have been totally logically sound. There's been nothing extreme in any of it. Every young parent I know is so relieved with what he's doing and frustrated that it took so long to do what seemed obvious.

But it's not that. It's inflammatory headline after inflammatory headline. It's putting words in his mouth, saying things he didn't say, making statements he didn't make, berating him in front of Congress for click bait video nonsense reading from a script.

It's exhausting. We're all tired of it. If you show me something that you think will convince me of something, I will look at it. And then I will look deeper. I will look to see if any information has been left out. I will look to see if editing has happened.

Because almost every time I invest the time to look into something, I find that it's exaggerated internet nonsense that only plays well in echo chambers. When you do that enough times, your skepticism meter goes to 11.

Re: The Palantir app helping ICE raids in Minneapolis

#382

For an idea as to how this gets translated into the reality on the ground here in Minneapolis this is an article on what’s going on from the main newspaper in the state. > In the past week alone, ICE boxed in a Woodbury real estate agent recording their movements from his car, slammed him to the ground and detained him at the Whipple Federal Building near Fort Snelling for 10 hours. A 51-year-old teacher patrolling t…

If all those things happened in Spain where I live, I'm 99% we'd have actual riots on the streets, together with a lot of other unpleasant-but-needed civilian action, until things got better, like we've done in the past (sometimes maybe went slightly overboard with it, but better than nothing). Why are Americans so passive? You're literally transitioning into straight up authoritarianism, yet where are the riots? How…

spain isn’t a great example here. it has some of the most racist fans football has ever seen and yet there’s no action. only italy probably compares. if there was a government agency going after black and brown people (ie non-white) i wouldn’t bet on the spanish population to come to their rescue. lamine yamal, a young footballer of moroccan descent hasn’t been spared the vitriol of the spanish hooligans even though he was top 3 best player at the recent euro (where he helped spain to victory).

point being, given that ice is going after non-whites and is getting by, a spanish ice will get by too, with probably more ease.

Re: The Palantir app helping ICE raids in Minneapolis

#383

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If all those things happened in Spain where I live, I'm 99% we'd have actual riots on the streets, together with a lot of other unpleasant-but-needed civilian action, until things got better, like we've done in the past (sometimes maybe went slightly overboard with it, but better than nothing). Why are Americans so passive? You're literally transitioning into straight up authoritarianism, yet where are the riots? How…

A pervasive "Someone needs to do something!!!" attitude is why. Americans will forever wait for the school principal to come and get everyone into trouble

There is a lot of direct action happening right now in Minneapolis, with people keeping watch on every block. I agree this level of organizing should be happening nationwide.

Re: The Palantir app helping ICE raids in Minneapolis

#384
There's a clear difference in the premises behind the thinking of the "right" vs. the "left". One side sees "evil officers acting too aggressively towards fellow humans", and the other side sees "patriotic police catching criminal aliens, and leftists attacking the police".

Those are the two ways of thinking I've noticed.

Re: The Palantir app helping ICE raids in Minneapolis

#385

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a thread about morals, not tech. Many people are talking about how immoral ICE (and therefore Palantir) is, and I want to present the side that they are in fact doing exactly what many people in our society thinks needs to be done (i.e. they are not immoral).

> I want to present the side that they are in fact doing exactly what many people in our society thinks needs to be done (i.e. they are not immoral). The Nazis were doing what many people in their society thought needed to be done. It is a rather uncommon position (though, ironically, frequently a strawman position falsely attributed to their opponents to mock them by roughly the same political faction that backs the…

[flagged]

Re: The Palantir app helping ICE raids in Minneapolis

#386
post #297

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I completely agree in principle, these threads get very very heated so I can kinda see why HN/dang/our reptilian overlords are trying to keep them from becoming a majority of the site (which they easily could be, absent the flagging of these stories).

Sure, within reason. Also, I totally understand pruning back discussion that is political, and way off the topic of the actual post/story. People should reasonably be able to read and discuss a non-political story without big political discussion springing up.

Yeah, I don't know where you draw the line. Like, I personally have often gotten a lot of value from HN political threads, but they have been getting worse and worse since about 2016 (I wonder what happened then?) so I can see why other people might just be sick of dealing with the noise.

Re: The Palantir app helping ICE raids in Minneapolis

#387

For an idea as to how this gets translated into the reality on the ground here in Minneapolis this is an article on what’s going on from the main newspaper in the state. > In the past week alone, ICE boxed in a Woodbury real estate agent recording their movements from his car, slammed him to the ground and detained him at the Whipple Federal Building near Fort Snelling for 10 hours. A 51-year-old teacher patrolling t…

If all those things happened in Spain where I live, I'm 99% we'd have actual riots on the streets, together with a lot of other unpleasant-but-needed civilian action, until things got better, like we've done in the past (sometimes maybe went slightly overboard with it, but better than nothing). Why are Americans so passive? You're literally transitioning into straight up authoritarianism, yet where are the riots? How…

Imo, there is too much of an individualistic culture here. Where I am people live for twenty years and barely even know their neighbors.

Re: The Palantir app helping ICE raids in Minneapolis

#388

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If all those things happened in Spain where I live, I'm 99% we'd have actual riots on the streets, together with a lot of other unpleasant-but-needed civilian action, until things got better, like we've done in the past (sometimes maybe went slightly overboard with it, but better than nothing). Why are Americans so passive? You're literally transitioning into straight up authoritarianism, yet where are the riots? How…

To be fair, Minneapolis is raising hell and has been for the last week. There have been many protests in other cities as well. I would also say that Trump and his cronies would absolutely love if this boils over into a violent riot. That would give them permission to double down.

I keep hearing this idea that boiling over lets them double down, but at the same time, it is not acceptable to let them keep doing what they do. Once the government starts using physical violence against the people and openly violating constitutional law, there is no choice, but to push back.

But that pushback can look different. Personally, I think that needs to be a massive general strike across every major city.

Re: The Palantir app helping ICE raids in Minneapolis

#389

For an idea as to how this gets translated into the reality on the ground here in Minneapolis this is an article on what’s going on from the main newspaper in the state. > In the past week alone, ICE boxed in a Woodbury real estate agent recording their movements from his car, slammed him to the ground and detained him at the Whipple Federal Building near Fort Snelling for 10 hours. A 51-year-old teacher patrolling t…

If all those things happened in Spain where I live, I'm 99% we'd have actual riots on the streets, together with a lot of other unpleasant-but-needed civilian action, until things got better, like we've done in the past (sometimes maybe went slightly overboard with it, but better than nothing). Why are Americans so passive? You're literally transitioning into straight up authoritarianism, yet where are the riots? How…

We don't have the memory of the end of an authoritarian regime only fifty years in our past.

Re: The Palantir app helping ICE raids in Minneapolis

#390

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If all those things happened in Spain where I live, I'm 99% we'd have actual riots on the streets, together with a lot of other unpleasant-but-needed civilian action, until things got better, like we've done in the past (sometimes maybe went slightly overboard with it, but better than nothing). Why are Americans so passive? You're literally transitioning into straight up authoritarianism, yet where are the riots? How…

Because I have a kid to take care of. A job I need to keep, and a way of life I'd like to maintain. Because it's not happening where I live (yet). I care about people but I don't give a fuck about my country. It's just a place to live. If it gets too bad I'll move my family elsewhere. Also, this whole checks and balances thing we learned about in school will surely kick in sometime soon...

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