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Mozilla's open source AI strategy

blog.mozilla.org

41–50 of 213 posts

Re: Mozilla's open source AI strategy

#41
post #38

The open source community will start taking Firefox seriously again when all the AI shit is removed for good and real improvements to performance and privacy are made. Despite all the posturing about "respecting your privacy and freedom," the stock configuration of Firefox is trivially fingerprintable. At the very least, a privacy-focused browser should adopt the Tor patches and report standardized spoofed values for…

I am going with the Waterfox / Librewolf forks

Re: Mozilla's open source AI strategy

#42
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is always a pile on on Firebox for not being perfect. Sometimes with valid complaints. But if you dig deeper nearly always the commenter is using a version of Chrome and justifies it over Firefox for a very shallow or outdated reason. Firefox would do well to listen to some of the criticism about the browser and ignore the noise about anything else There's also the cohort of bad web developers that only test on…

As someone that uses Firefox as my main browser on desktop and mobile, I am curious here - what exactly are the complaints with Firefox? I'm using 3+ year old hardware that was mid-range even when it was new and it seems to do everything I would want with reasonable performance.

Major problems with Firefox include:

  - full uBlock support

  - the ability to still be themed

  - first-party isolation
...Okay, okay, I’m being too cheeky.

The common wisdom is that overall Firefox can feel bottlenecked at render and draw times (“less snappy”). That could be a result of a slower JavaScript engine (takes longer to get to drawing), or a result of poorer hardware acceleration (slower drawing), or a less optimized multiprocessing/multithreading model (more resource contention when drawing).

I honestly can't see it in the real world, but synthetic benchmark are pretty clear on that front.

Re: Mozilla's open source AI strategy

#43
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, but LangChain / LangGraph tools are also Open Source so its not really Mozilla bringing their Open Source culture as a differentiating factor from their competitors.

Ah. I had assumed that these were tools built or contributed to by Mozilla.

Mozilla is indeed developing some Open Source AI tools which will then be used in their proprietary and paying SaaS AI agent platform.

What I meant to say is that existing competing solutions like LangGraph and LangChain are already Open Source themselves. So releasing Open Source AI libraries is not a new twist that Mozilla is bringing.

Re: Mozilla's open source AI strategy

#44
post #38

The open source community will start taking Firefox seriously again when all the AI shit is removed for good and real improvements to performance and privacy are made. Despite all the posturing about "respecting your privacy and freedom," the stock configuration of Firefox is trivially fingerprintable. At the very least, a privacy-focused browser should adopt the Tor patches and report standardized spoofed values for…

I'd definitely love to see them take some steps, but at the points where a minor increase in privacy leads to a much worse UX for average people (aka, "why doesn't this site work in FF, FF sucks!" because they don't know they have to enable something). If Firefox becomes a browser that is harder to use then it will only ever be used by the extremely small niche of people that care about that. That will only further lead to more "not tested on Firefox" web development. I already have to have Chrome available on my machine because of sites like Ramp.com and Mailgun that don't work on Firefox, and that would only get worse.

Re: Mozilla's open source AI strategy

#45
post #38

The open source community will start taking Firefox seriously again when all the AI shit is removed for good and real improvements to performance and privacy are made. Despite all the posturing about "respecting your privacy and freedom," the stock configuration of Firefox is trivially fingerprintable. At the very least, a privacy-focused browser should adopt the Tor patches and report standardized spoofed values for…

Unfortunately, the guys in charge at Mozilla are clearly enamored with AI. They like it so much (and value users so little), that they'll let it write the whole damn PR blog post about company strategy.

Re: Mozilla's open source AI strategy

#46
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is always a pile on on Firebox for not being perfect. Sometimes with valid complaints. But if you dig deeper nearly always the commenter is using a version of Chrome and justifies it over Firefox for a very shallow or outdated reason. Firefox would do well to listen to some of the criticism about the browser and ignore the noise about anything else There's also the cohort of bad web developers that only test on…

As someone that uses Firefox as my main browser on desktop and mobile, I am curious here - what exactly are the complaints with Firefox? I'm using 3+ year old hardware that was mid-range even when it was new and it seems to do everything I would want with reasonable performance.

Hum.

I have at home 13 year old hardware running Firefox and no performance complaints.

Re: Mozilla's open source AI strategy

#47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The ubiquity of their plugin model is why. Near all editors have a VS code plugin compatible layer

> Near all editors have a VS code plugin compatible layer Huh, never heard about this before, and took a look at emacs and vim/neovim as those are the two most popular editors I know of, neither can run VS code plugins, that'd be crazy if true.

Very long time vim/neovim user here. I can't remember names atm and can't check, but I have definitely seen plugins that run a headless or subset of VScode in the background to pull info from it. It may not be super common, but it is being done

Re: Mozilla's open source AI strategy

#48
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is always a pile on on Firebox for not being perfect. Sometimes with valid complaints. But if you dig deeper nearly always the commenter is using a version of Chrome and justifies it over Firefox for a very shallow or outdated reason. Firefox would do well to listen to some of the criticism about the browser and ignore the noise about anything else There's also the cohort of bad web developers that only test on…

As someone that uses Firefox as my main browser on desktop and mobile, I am curious here - what exactly are the complaints with Firefox? I'm using 3+ year old hardware that was mid-range even when it was new and it seems to do everything I would want with reasonable performance.

> what exactly are the complaints with Firefox?

If you are a (the) leading browser like Firefox once was, the "what are the complaints?" is the right question.

If you are a minor browser like Firefox currently is (~2.5% market share), the "what is it doing better?" is the correct question.

Re: Mozilla's open source AI strategy

#49

> Mozilla was born to change this, and Firefox succeeded beyond what most people thought possible — dropping Internet Explorer’s market share to 55% in just a few years and ushering in the Web 2.0 era. Is this true? I can see from here[0] that its peak was 32%, as IE was really on the back burner but before Chrome had fully risen to dominance, but I wouldn't claim that it was responsible for IE's market share drop. […

When do you think the "web 2.0 era" was? Web 2.0 is around 2003 or so and chrome would not even exist for another few years. Giving Firefox/phoenix/Netscape the majority credit for the first fall of IE seems accurate. The rise of chrome happened afterwards and by then IE also fell much deeper than 55%.

Yeah, my anecdotal memories aren't worth much, but in that era it was all IE or Firefox. Even once Chrome came along it still took quite some time before I noticed it popping up on normie people's systems.

Re: Mozilla's open source AI strategy

#50
Like many here on HN, I’m skeptical, also about Mozilla, but the blog post is compelling in its plan plus there’s a new CEO in town.

So I think what we can do is give them the benefit of the doubt and approach this with cautious optimism for now instead of just negativity.

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