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Shut up and play nice: How the Western world is limiting free speech

washingtonpost.com

11–20 of 284 posts

Re: Shut up and play nice: How the Western world is limiting free speech

#11
post #10

What I find chilling is in the age of the internet the comment sections on news sites are heavily censored (e.g. CBC). Which seems to allow a strange mix of viewpoints but what you don't see is what worries me. As for insulting religions it's funny that most times it's religion against religion more than non-religious again religious.

the CBC comments section is heavily censored? Looking at it I didn't think they even had moderators.

Re: Shut up and play nice: How the Western world is limiting free speech

#12
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An analogy doesn't automatically become bad just because it was once used to support a bad policy. :)

It does become suspect if the underlying logic is the same, though. I might call "clear and present danger" ethically problematic, but it was hardly unjustified.

Not really. I could say that talking about kittens is like yelling fire in a crowded theater. The fire-in-a-crowded-theater argument is not diminished because I did a bad job of lining up reality with the analogy. The problem comes in when people are allowed to say, X is like ..., without X actually being like that.

Re: Shut up and play nice: How the Western world is limiting free speech

#13
post #9

Why can't the article just come out and say what it means? Militant Islam scares the crap out of the West, and we're willing to pass laws and endure a certain level of self-censorship to avoid provoking violence out of these people. The simple lesson here is that if you want to stop non-believers from doing blasphemy, violent reprisals work . And really, self-censorship is a practical stance, if not a principled one.…

"The simple lesson here is that if you want to stop non-believers from doing blasphemy, violent reprisals work."

And it's the wrong lesson learned. Violent reprisals didn't happen as a result of blasphemy, but of murder and occupation and dominance.

Re: Shut up and play nice: How the Western world is limiting free speech

#14
post #9

Why can't the article just come out and say what it means? Militant Islam scares the crap out of the West, and we're willing to pass laws and endure a certain level of self-censorship to avoid provoking violence out of these people. The simple lesson here is that if you want to stop non-believers from doing blasphemy, violent reprisals work . And really, self-censorship is a practical stance, if not a principled one.…

> Militant Islam scares the crap out of the West, and we're willing to pass laws and endure a certain level of self-censorship to avoid provoking violence out of these people.

This is such a stupid strategy. The right thing to do is to look at the root cause of all this. After all, there are lots of angry people all across the world that hate the Western world and want to hurt it, but most can't. What sets the Arabs apart is their vast oil riches. Without that, they wouldn't have the money or power to do anything to the West.

If you want to fight militant Islam, the first thing to do is to limit immigration from those countries and spread the immigrants out to force assimilation. The second thing to do is to invest as much money as possible into developing domestic energy sources, as well as alternatives to crude oil. The minute that crude oil loses its relevance to the Western world, the Arabs will just go back to what they were before - a bunch of desert nomads with no real power.

Re: Shut up and play nice: How the Western world is limiting free speech

#17
post #9

Why can't the article just come out and say what it means? Militant Islam scares the crap out of the West, and we're willing to pass laws and endure a certain level of self-censorship to avoid provoking violence out of these people. The simple lesson here is that if you want to stop non-believers from doing blasphemy, violent reprisals work . And really, self-censorship is a practical stance, if not a principled one.…

because the lessons of history are that appeasement works...

Re: Shut up and play nice: How the Western world is limiting free speech

#18
post #9

Why can't the article just come out and say what it means? Militant Islam scares the crap out of the West, and we're willing to pass laws and endure a certain level of self-censorship to avoid provoking violence out of these people. The simple lesson here is that if you want to stop non-believers from doing blasphemy, violent reprisals work . And really, self-censorship is a practical stance, if not a principled one.…

> Militant Islam scares the crap out of the West, and we're willing to pass laws and endure a certain level of self-censorship to avoid provoking violence out of these people. This is such a stupid strategy. The right thing to do is to look at the root cause of all this. After all, there are lots of angry people all across the world that hate the Western world and want to hurt it, but most can't. What sets the Arabs…

This would be a good strategy to stop state sponsored attacks, but what about the rest? What about the World Trade Center attacks? The 2002 Bali bombings? The 2005 London bombings?

Re: Shut up and play nice: How the Western world is limiting free speech

#19
post #9

Why can't the article just come out and say what it means? Militant Islam scares the crap out of the West, and we're willing to pass laws and endure a certain level of self-censorship to avoid provoking violence out of these people. The simple lesson here is that if you want to stop non-believers from doing blasphemy, violent reprisals work . And really, self-censorship is a practical stance, if not a principled one.…

"The simple lesson here is that if you want to stop non-believers from doing blasphemy, violent reprisals work." And it's the wrong lesson learned. Violent reprisals didn't happen as a result of blasphemy, but of murder and occupation and dominance.

I think you are right that most of the violence we see aren't really a result of hate speach.

However, I think the parent's point is still valid in the more general sense, that our weakening of free speech due to threats of violence sends the signal that terrorism is an effective means of politics. Having said that, reading a history books also sends that signal, although it likely frames it in terms of guerilla warfare, and cutting losses, and such.

Re: Shut up and play nice: How the Western world is limiting free speech

#20
This is really interesting in light of the recent reddit fiasco involving violentacrez and voyeuristic photos being published. I mean people were clearly up in arms about the invasion of privacy and supported subreddits like creepshots being banned despite the fact that they're perfectly legal. I wonder whether these same people see the similiarity between themselves and Muslims who want the blasphemous publication of prophets banned.
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