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Sugar, acid and teeth (2009)

dbskeptic.com

91–100 of 108 posts

Re: Sugar, acid and teeth (2009)

#91
I can't see how second best sorbitol and the best being Xylitol are any better than sugar they're sugar alcohols which have the effects of a laxitive.

How about just not eating so much sugar, and if you're diabetic try stevia that's what my mother, a diabetic, chooses.

Re: Sugar, acid and teeth (2009)

#92
post #71
post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

http://www.snopes.com/cokelore/tooth.asp suggests that submerging teeth in any acidic substance (e.g. orange juice) will soften and eventually dissolve them. Since this does not adequately replicate conditions in the mouth, it would not be useful to determine how such substances affect enamel.

I don't see how "not adequately replicating mouth conditions" leads to "would not be useful to determine effect on enamel". Yes, there will be significant differences between drinking Coke and soaking a tooth in Coke overnight. But that doesn't mean it won't provide a useful basis for comparison! Possibly even more useful than the arbitrary formula the author and dentist in the article came up with.

What useful basis does it provide?

Re: Sugar, acid and teeth (2009)

#93
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What the equation says to me is that acidity sets the stage for tooth damage, but as bad as that is, once you start feeding the bacteria in that set stage, you are in real trouble. However, the entire article is a hypothesis . It is a best guess by somebody with scientific knowledge, but there is no reason to believe the real formula shouldn't be 10^(5.5-ph)+10(mg/cl sugar) or something completely different. However,…

How about the following: 1. Find a substance that is chemically tooth-like 2. Split it into predefined volumes (little cubes or spheres) 3. Add the beverage and saliva to the "tooth", wait a month, and measure the decrease in "tooth" volume. 4. Use regression to estimate the coefficients for sugar, pH, and whatever else.

You would be missing the bacteria, which are essential.

Re: Sugar, acid and teeth (2009)

#94

There's some effort underway to develop a vaccine against dental caries: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caries_vaccine

Indeed, there are some very exciting prospects here. The replacement therapy seems most promising. I developed a number of cavities out of the blue after I began aggressively using mouthwash - my theory is that I had a mostly benevolent strain of bacteria and accidentally killed them off, and they were eventually replaced with a nastier strain. If a harmless strain could be administered through vaccine or chewing gum, the societal effects would be enormous. Seems like the largest problem left (as usual, sadly) is getting it out of the lab.

Re: Sugar, acid and teeth (2009)

#98
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I love the conviction with which you say that. So, there is no difference between compounds that we've evolved to consume over millions of years, and ones which were designed in the last 30 to be as addictive and as cheap to make as possible? While I do not claim that there is evidence of difference (I cannot provide any), it is unfounded to claim that there is none, whether based on some (inherently) limited study o…

Your entire post is nothing but fallacies. You don't evolve to do anything. And you didn't evolve in the presence of orange juice, oranges didn't exist. And it doesn't matter, because that is just the naturalistic fallacy. Something being "natural" doesn't make it good, and something being "artificial" doesn't make it bad. We did not evolve with modern tooth cleaning equipment or flouride treatments either, but those…

It would help to read what I was replying to, and what I was actually replying:

GP said: "Juice is for most intents and purposes no healthier dan soda."

You said: "There is absolutely no evidence to support the notion that pop is any worse for you than a fruit juice of similar acidity and caloric content."

I said: "There is no evidence of difference", which is exactly what you said.

Can you spot the difference between yourself and GP, though? One is an assertion; the other is an assertion of no evidence against said assertion.

> "You don't evolve to do anything"

We clearly don't speak the same language. What do you mean by that? I breathe; did I not evolve to breathe?

Where did I state that everything "natural is good" or that anything "artificial is bad"? Who and what are you arguing with?

Re: Sugar, acid and teeth (2009)

#99
post #77
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I love the conviction with which you say that. So, there is no difference between compounds that we've evolved to consume over millions of years, and ones which were designed in the last 30 to be as addictive and as cheap to make as possible? While I do not claim that there is evidence of difference (I cannot provide any), it is unfounded to claim that there is none, whether based on some (inherently) limited study o…

By defining "fruit juice" to be something almost nobody ever consumes, then declaring the actual fruit juice people actually consume as being bad, it seems to me that you're agreeing with him while using language that pretends you're not.

Well, I accept the criticism.

I grew up knowing actual fresh squeezed orange juice as "orange juice", and everything else as "orange beverage" (well, an equivalent translation in my native language).

But I realize that, since I moved to the US, I haven't actually had anything that tastes like real Orange Juice. Regardless of what it says on the package or what the waiter says.

Re: Sugar, acid and teeth (2009)

#100
post #90

I never drink any sugary juices or candy. Eat lots of fruits and veggies, also bread, milk and nuts. And I have terrible tooth decay. Seems a bit silly to compare pHs of various junk foods. Drinking a better pH won't make much difference. The problem is a tad more complicated.

I had terrible tooth decay when I was younger (I have 16 fillings from ages 10-20). And then, all of a sudden - nothing. I haven't had a hole or a problem since (except for a filling that broke and had to be replaced). There was nothing that I'm aware of that I changed around that time -- I stopped drinking sodas and eating junk food around age 30.

But I have recently read claims (and testimonials) that what you need for healthy teeth is Vitamin D (make sure you take it in the morning if you do!) and Vitamin K2, see e.g. http://www.thedentalessentials.com/The_role_of_vitamin_k2_on... ; If you find this interesting, you'll find a lot more similar stuff on the bulletproof executive forums.

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