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If You're Too Busy to Meditate, Read This

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Re: If You're Too Busy to Meditate, Read This

#51

Post by KirinDave »

Dove wrote: post #10
KirinDave wrote: post #8

Wait. Wait wait wait. > Research shows that an ability to resist urges will improve your relationships, increase your dependability, and raise your performance... Great. Yes. Impulse control is key. Delayed gratification is part of how we define higher intelligence. Meditation has what do with this, exactly? > How [does meditation help]? By increasing your capacity to resist distracting urges. This entire article is…

I don't know, I thought he explained it pretty well: during meditation, you practice resisting urges. I'll admit that falls rather short of a doubleblindrandomlyassignedcontrolgrouplargesamplesizepeerreviewed study, but it does seem to be common sense that practicing something would make you better at it.

"during meditation, you practice resisting urges."

Saying this does not make it true thought. Is that actually what people do during meditation? The only experience I have with meditation is sitting in seiza position after 2 hours of Ki Aikido, slowly feeling my muscles cramp, listening to someone hit a drum periodically, and not feeling anything good at all.

Eventually I just learned to devote that time to reviewing things I had learned that day. I found this self-reflective practice far more refreshing and pleasant than any search for metaphorical emptiness.

Re: If You're Too Busy to Meditate, Read This

#52

Post by zabar »

webwanderings wrote: post #2

The misconception about meditation is that it requires one to give up everything and sit silently. This is not true in its entirety as it depends on how one interprets the word "meditation". The meditation does not necessarily require you to give up one thing for the sake of another. The goal of the meditation is to "be in awareness" and you can achieve this same goal by being alert and aware with any activity your f…

I completely agree with the point.

I've been playing guitar (blues improv) long before I started meditating, and I really noticed the similarities in the state of mind it put you in.

I've been an insomniac for a long time and meditating did help me a lot. Be it playing guitar, sitting or doing yoga.

Re: If You're Too Busy to Meditate, Read This

#53

Post by KirinDave »

bennesvig wrote: post #35
dchest wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is an analogy, it may be true or false. Download speed is a muscle. By downloading more files you're building up your download speed.

That analogy doesn't work. Meditations influence is covered in depth in The Willpower Instinct, but here's a short summary. ""Meditation requires you to tap all the self-regulation systems in your brain as well as the self-monitoring mechanism," says Kelly McGonigal, PhD, a health psychologist at Stanford University and author of the forthcoming The Willpower Instinct. Every time you meditate, you use two important p…

Does the Willpower Instinct contain any sort of actual empirical analysis of the subject? Or is it just someone with a PhD saying something?

Because medical professionals can believe in magic and bullshit just as easily as anyone else.

Re: If You're Too Busy to Meditate, Read This

#54

Post by tylee78 »

webwanderings wrote: post #2

The misconception about meditation is that it requires one to give up everything and sit silently. This is not true in its entirety as it depends on how one interprets the word "meditation". The meditation does not necessarily require you to give up one thing for the sake of another. The goal of the meditation is to "be in awareness" and you can achieve this same goal by being alert and aware with any activity your f…

The idea behind meditation is not that difficult to understand. However, it is watered down quite a bit, especially if you learn it in a New Age environment. If you go back to the old schools of meditation, the techniques are very clear and straight forward and can be applied in daily life. It is really helpful though to know some meditation principles:

http://theravadin.wordpress.com/2010/09/30/surfing-on-the-wa...

http://theravadin.wordpress.com/2010/11/03/anussati-sinking-...

Re: If You're Too Busy to Meditate, Read This

#55

Post by KirinDave »

Fishkins wrote: post #37
KirinDave wrote: post #8

Wait. Wait wait wait. > Research shows that an ability to resist urges will improve your relationships, increase your dependability, and raise your performance... Great. Yes. Impulse control is key. Delayed gratification is part of how we define higher intelligence. Meditation has what do with this, exactly? > How [does meditation help]? By increasing your capacity to resist distracting urges. This entire article is…

There's definitely evidence that meditation alters your brain in positive ways [1]. The phrase "impulse control" isn't used in the list of benefits, but they list improvements in traits I'd associate with impulse control, e.g. increased self-awareness and reduced anxiety. [1] http://www.familyhealthguide.co.uk/mindfulness-meditation-le...

Sounds like similar benefits to exercising.

Re: If You're Too Busy to Meditate, Read This

#56

Post by muraiki »

stephth wrote: post #4

Focus on your breath going in and out. Every time you have a thought or an urge, notice it and bring yourself back to your breath. From what I've heard so far, meditation is based on focusing on your body in order to quiet your mind. Are there other schools/techniques?

I realize that I already replied to this once, but I wanted to make another response not directly related to my other one, and it seemed too lengthly to add as an edit. I apologize if this is frowned upon at HN.

In Soto Zen Buddhism, the point isn't necessarily to "quiet the mind," because that implies that the running rivers of thoughts somehow dry up and give rise to a silent stillness. This may be the goal of some forms of meditation, but it is not the interpretation of Zen.

Dogen Zenji preferred to use the term shikantaza, which means something like "nothing but to hit sit," or less literally, "just sitting." The understanding is that rejecting thoughts is the other side of the coin of embracing thoughts: both are rooted in attachment to the thought, identification of the thought with the illusion of self or ego.

The "purpose" of shikantaza, also known as zazen (sitting meditation), is to neither accept nor reject thoughts. Thus the mind isn't necessarily becoming "quiet," but rather the process of self-aggrandizement is discontinued.

It might seem like I'm nitpicking over your word choice, but Zen in particular is a school that is very focused on how language itself is rooted in the concept of "I" and our ego. You can contrast shikantaza to other forms of meditation that utilize a particular focus, such as an image, which is something that Zen would not generally endorse (for you would simply be displacing grasping at one thing with another thing).

Shikantaza is tied to "thusness," or being fully in the moment, which webwanderings above explains quite well.

Re: If You're Too Busy to Meditate, Read This

#57

Post by eof »

KirinDave wrote: post #8

Wait. Wait wait wait. > Research shows that an ability to resist urges will improve your relationships, increase your dependability, and raise your performance... Great. Yes. Impulse control is key. Delayed gratification is part of how we define higher intelligence. Meditation has what do with this, exactly? > How [does meditation help]? By increasing your capacity to resist distracting urges. This entire article is…

Article is not wrong about this. It is hard to measure what meditation is doing on a subjective level, which is very specific and easy to talk about amongst people who have spent even an hour meditating.

The key here, which for you might be a leap of faith, is that when one tries to simply focus on their breath (or the dishes), completely without our permission thoughts continue to pop into our head. The 'natural' thing to do is follow these thoughts; and there is a will of resistance to go back to your breath again and again. It is hard to do, and get easier with practice.

Anyone who has spent say, >3 hours of their life meditating will recognize it as a fact that meditation strengthens your will.

Re: If You're Too Busy to Meditate, Read This

#58

Post by codegeek »

KirinDave wrote: post #8

Wait. Wait wait wait. > Research shows that an ability to resist urges will improve your relationships, increase your dependability, and raise your performance... Great. Yes. Impulse control is key. Delayed gratification is part of how we define higher intelligence. Meditation has what do with this, exactly? > How [does meditation help]? By increasing your capacity to resist distracting urges. This entire article is…

"Meditation has what do with this, exactly?"

I think you are taking an extreme position on this issue. Meditation may not have everything to do with this but it does play a significant part. In my experience, meditation helps you analyze, hold and channel your thought process better. If your thought process is better, you have better control over your impulses.

Re: If You're Too Busy to Meditate, Read This

#59

Post by roqetman »

KirinDave wrote: post #49
acgourley wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're right he doesn't back up the claim, but that's just because it's so well accepted by people who study this he didn't even think he had to.

I'd like to actually see some evidence that Meditation helps people sustain that state of mind. Because I hear people trot it out a lot but I've never seen it backed up by hard data. I think meditation may have benefits, but the idea that it helps you "build up willpower" has always been one I thought we could actually measure, and yet I've never seen a good study of it.

I used to also wait for all the data before I tried things like this. Then due to "reasons" I actually started meditation, daily, for just 10 minutes. I've now been doing it for 3 years and I have no data to give you, but the effects on me are subtle yet profound. If you can spare 10 minutes a day you still won't have any data, but you'll have an answer.

Re: If You're Too Busy to Meditate, Read This

#60

Post by jcl »

dchest wrote: post #26
bennesvig wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Willpower is a muscle. By wanting to do things, but focusing on meditation, you're building up your willpower muscle.

This is an analogy, it may be true or false. Download speed is a muscle. By downloading more files you're building up your download speed.

The analogy is true, insofar as there are experiments that support it.

https://www.google.com/search?q=willpower+muscle+research

More interestingly, there is research that suggests that believing that willpower is like a muscle impairs willpower. :)

http://pss.sagepub.com/content/21/11/1686

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