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Resistance training load does not determine hypertrophy

physoc.onlinelibrary.wiley.com

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Re: Resistance training load does not determine hypertrophy

#221

Post by astura »

toshinoriyagi wrote: post #92
mahdi7d1 wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it's not painfull you are not exerting enough effort at least that's the case in the gym. People who are refreshed and more energetic after going to the gym are the same people who won't improve beyond intermediate levels. The ones who let go of the any set at the first feelings of unease and never take a set close to failure. It's actually fascinating how an ancient proverb could line up with modern science so pe…

It certainly does not need to be painful. I think most people will make a distinction between the burn of acidosis, or what you call unease, and actual pain indicating damage is occurring. But yes, if you never train close to failure you will not grow, not past beginner gains, unless you take steroids.

> think most people will make a distinction between the burn of acidosis, or what you call unease, and actual pain indicating damage is occurring.

There's not a discernible distinction for me. Which is why I always hate hearing shit like "It should feel uncomfortable but not painful." Like, no, it's FUCKING PAINFUL! It HURTS!

Re: Resistance training load does not determine hypertrophy

#222

Post by MegaDeKay »

bargainbin wrote: post #199
formichunter wrote: post #190

Why is this article showing up on New Year's Day like the flock of newbie gym customers attracted to the gym only to quit 30 days from now? Every year without fail. Let's ignore this article for a moment. Overall factors that REALLY matter building muscle: 1. Consistency - Working out each muscle group at least once a week....every week. 2. Diet - Making sure you are consuming enough protein in your diet, approximate…

>1. Consistency >5. Vary your workout The muscle "shock" broscience has been disproven many times: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35438660/ https://www.researchgate.net/publication/349502442_Does_Vary...

Indeed. It is really just tension x time under tension within a sensible rep range (probably around 5 - 30 reps or so). Menno on Youtube has a bunch of videos on this, the link below being the latest one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rmOBmTZARq8

Basically work the muscle harder and get more jacked. It isn't that hard. Full body workouts are also great for this reason: you can hit a muscle more times per week and be fresher when you hit that muscle, so both the tension and time under tension can be higher vs a body part split.

Re: Resistance training load does not determine hypertrophy

#223

Post by evanjrowley »

malfist wrote: post #215
andreareina wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Brad Schoenfeld felt the same way, so he did the study on trained participants, and made the same finding: https://journals.lww.com/nsca-jscr/fulltext/2015/10000/Effec...

That is a very underpowered study, only 18 participants

Is there another study with more than 18 participants and results that conflict with this study here?

Re: Resistance training load does not determine hypertrophy

#224

Post by worldsavior »

randysalami wrote: post #195

I just do light weight nowadays with my strength training. It’s easier mentally. Rather than push myself to go higher on bench, squat, and deadlift, I stick to 1 plate for bench and squat and 2 plates for deadlift. Every single time. Instead of increasing load, I increase rep amount and focus on my form. Honestly, I still find myself sore after most workouts and the simplicity is nice. I’m 25 for reference.

You won't see any progress if you won't push yourself. It shapes your mentality, and running away from work is what will keep you at the same place. Soreness is not a sign of progression most of the time. Bump up the weights, don't run away.

Re: Resistance training load does not determine hypertrophy

#225

Post by AstroBen »

andreareina wrote: post #149
AstroBen wrote: post #34

> Healthy, recreationally active but untrained young males Yeah this is why. Anything you do as an untrained person is going to get you newbie gains. It's just really easy to improve initially. Doesn't mean it'll work after the first 6 months

Brad Schoenfeld felt the same way, so he did the study on trained participants, and made the same finding: https://journals.lww.com/nsca-jscr/fulltext/2015/10000/Effec...

Oh that's interesting

> it is possible that the type I fibers of subjects were underdeveloped in comparison with the type II fibers as a result of training methodologies. The type I fibers therefore may have had a greater potential for growth compared with the type II fibers

Maybe a mix of both types of training would be best then?

Re: Resistance training load does not determine hypertrophy

#226

Post by CuriouslyC »

MegaDeKay wrote: post #222
bargainbin wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>1. Consistency >5. Vary your workout The muscle "shock" broscience has been disproven many times: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35438660/ https://www.researchgate.net/publication/349502442_Does_Vary...

Indeed. It is really just tension x time under tension within a sensible rep range (probably around 5 - 30 reps or so). Menno on Youtube has a bunch of videos on this, the link below being the latest one. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rmOBmTZARq8 Basically work the muscle harder and get more jacked. It isn't that hard. Full body workouts are also great for this reason: you can hit a muscle more times per week and b…

Time under tension is an imperfect measure, it's just less bad than other measures we could use. Sort of like lines of code in software engineering. Given that, saying it's "just TUT" is misleading.

It could turn out to be that the brain is coordinating hypertrophic biochemical cascades in muscles, and TUT is just a fairly reliable method for inducing this.

I was a competitive powerlifter and trained around pro bodybuilders for years, and in my experience, the only commonality between them was the intense all consuming drive to be absolutely monstrous (and they ate a lot). Some would train for 2 hours a day, some would train for 45 minutes 3x a week, some would use high volume in the 50-70% range and others would focus on 70-85%, some were explosive some were slow and steady, really it was all over the map.

Re: Resistance training load does not determine hypertrophy

#227

Post by patmorgan23 »

d357r0y3r wrote: post #211
spectralista wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just got back from the gym and it was surprisingly empty. Actually, more empty than normal. My experience from lifting now for 30+ years and seeing thousands of people lift is it is: 1. Genetics. Everything else is a distant second or third. This was actually something that was widely understood in 90s bodybuilding magazines. Lifting is mostly a display of genetics. That worked when you could sell magazines of gene…

It really is just mostly this, and social media has tricked people into thinking otherwise. I was looking at some photos of myself about 10 years ago. At the time, I had been hitting the gym hard, consistently, and intelligently. I had a huge bench press, squad, and deadlift, and was lifting 4-5 days a week, and managed every facet of my diet. Now, I'm older, have kids, don't sleep as much, and definitely don't make…

Counter argument, muscle maintenance is a lot easier than muscle growth. Of course you don't look that different now, you have done enough work to significantly change your physique, but done plenty to maintain.

Re: Resistance training load does not determine hypertrophy

#228

Post by astura »

cyberax wrote: post #33
Torkel wrote: post #10

I.e. No pain, no gain.

This is really terrible advice that just discourages people. You absolutely can get significant improvements without (much) pain. DOMS during the initial stages is going to be the most uncomfortable part. Once you're past it, you don't need to push yourself to a breaking point, just to the point of mild exhaustion. This will provide you enough resistance to gain muscle mass and improve the bone density to healthy lev…

I think propensity for Delayed Onset Muscle Soreness (DOMS) must be genetic or something because I've never been able to get "past it," even after many years.

Re: Resistance training load does not determine hypertrophy

#230

Post by jeltz »

bargainbin wrote: post #199
formichunter wrote: post #190

Why is this article showing up on New Year's Day like the flock of newbie gym customers attracted to the gym only to quit 30 days from now? Every year without fail. Let's ignore this article for a moment. Overall factors that REALLY matter building muscle: 1. Consistency - Working out each muscle group at least once a week....every week. 2. Diet - Making sure you are consuming enough protein in your diet, approximate…

>1. Consistency >5. Vary your workout The muscle "shock" broscience has been disproven many times: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35438660/ https://www.researchgate.net/publication/349502442_Does_Vary...

The reason for varying your workout I have heard is to avoid injury, not to be stronger. Of course it may turn out that is false too.
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