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Efficient method to capture carbon dioxide from the atmosphere

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Re: Efficient method to capture carbon dioxide from the atmosphere

#121

Post by ctoth »

_yb2s wrote: post #67
condiment wrote: post #45

At current rates of emissions, we’re only about 20 years away from people needing to install CO2 scrubbers in their homes. Soda lime, or calcium hydroxide, is the current state of the art. We use that in an anesthesia and in saltwater aquariums and in scuba rebreathers. An idealized system can capture 500 mg per gram, but in practice you only capture around 250mg/g. This outperforms the method in the article but it’s…

I think it’s little appreciated that high CO2 levels cause cognitive impairment, and with the same amount of (often very poor) air exchange, higher outdoor concentrations can push indoor spaces to levels that cause impaired cognition and poor sleep. I’ve already been seeing this in my home, and will often open windows even when cold just to keep co2 levels reasonable. One solution that can help is an external air hea…

> higher outdoor concentrations can push indoor spaces to levels that cause impaired cognition

I am somewhat skeptical of this:

https://www.astralcodexten.com/p/eight-hundred-slightly-pois...

Re: Efficient method to capture carbon dioxide from the atmosphere

#122

Post by cassepipe »

malfist wrote: post #90
lokar wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really? Wow, I try to keep my place at 500-600, without that much effort.

I find it extremely unlikely that homes are routinely at 2000-3000 ppm. That is extremely high and would mean multiple people in a small area with no air exchange for a long while. I monitor my indoor co2, but don't take any action because it's extremely rare to be above 700 or 800. I can only remember a handful of times its reached 1k ppm. And my house should be prime candidate for co2, it was built during the era o…

If we are three in my small living room in winter (around 20m2), it easily climbs above to 2000ppm in less than an hour

Re: Efficient method to capture carbon dioxide from the atmosphere

#123

Post by graeme »

jmward01 wrote: post #114

I am not against doing research in this area, please do, it is interesting and likely has many applications but global CO2 removal isn't one of them. Nothing proposed, including this, is within any orders of magnitude of a viable solution. The only solution we have is put less in the air in the first place. This tech looks interesting for transporting CO2 but that doesn't mean it sequesters it and even if sequestrati…

We'll need this tech later. If and when we get emissions to net zero we'll still have too much CO2 in the air. Better to have begun the research now.

Re: Efficient method to capture carbon dioxide from the atmosphere

#124

Post by ctoth »

jmward01 wrote: post #114

I am not against doing research in this area, please do, it is interesting and likely has many applications but global CO2 removal isn't one of them. Nothing proposed, including this, is within any orders of magnitude of a viable solution. The only solution we have is put less in the air in the first place. This tech looks interesting for transporting CO2 but that doesn't mean it sequesters it and even if sequestrati…

> If we don't have the political will to reduce the amount going into the air then what makes anyone think we would have the political will to build out some system to capture and sequester?

Because political will requires coordination, building systems and turning them on doesn't have to!

> We need to focus more on not putting CO2 into the air and less on trying to take it out.

What part of the "we" in this coordination problem doesn't require political will?

Re: Efficient method to capture carbon dioxide from the atmosphere

#125

Post by cassepipe »

_yb2s wrote: post #67
condiment wrote: post #45

At current rates of emissions, we’re only about 20 years away from people needing to install CO2 scrubbers in their homes. Soda lime, or calcium hydroxide, is the current state of the art. We use that in an anesthesia and in saltwater aquariums and in scuba rebreathers. An idealized system can capture 500 mg per gram, but in practice you only capture around 250mg/g. This outperforms the method in the article but it’s…

I think it’s little appreciated that high CO2 levels cause cognitive impairment, and with the same amount of (often very poor) air exchange, higher outdoor concentrations can push indoor spaces to levels that cause impaired cognition and poor sleep. I’ve already been seeing this in my home, and will often open windows even when cold just to keep co2 levels reasonable. One solution that can help is an external air hea…

I have been monitoring for high CO2 for a few months now. I easily find myself in the 1000 - 1400 range for some time before I finally let some air in in winter.

I have not noticed significant cognitive impairment (not saying it did not happen)

Re: Efficient method to capture carbon dioxide from the atmosphere

#126

Post by wcoenen »

_yb2s wrote: post #67
condiment wrote: post #45

At current rates of emissions, we’re only about 20 years away from people needing to install CO2 scrubbers in their homes. Soda lime, or calcium hydroxide, is the current state of the art. We use that in an anesthesia and in saltwater aquariums and in scuba rebreathers. An idealized system can capture 500 mg per gram, but in practice you only capture around 250mg/g. This outperforms the method in the article but it’s…

I think it’s little appreciated that high CO2 levels cause cognitive impairment, and with the same amount of (often very poor) air exchange, higher outdoor concentrations can push indoor spaces to levels that cause impaired cognition and poor sleep. I’ve already been seeing this in my home, and will often open windows even when cold just to keep co2 levels reasonable. One solution that can help is an external air hea…

> Noticeable cognitive impairment starts in the 700-1000ppm range

The US navy failed to detect such effects in submarine crew, even at much higher levels like 10,000 ppm.

Another reason to be skeptical is that exhaled breath is 4% CO2 (40,000 ppm!). Therefore a few thousand extra ppm in the inhaled air should not make much of a difference to the homeostasis mechanisms in our bodies.

Re: Efficient method to capture carbon dioxide from the atmosphere

#127

Post by nine_k »

marcosdumay wrote: post #71
condiment wrote: post #45

At current rates of emissions, we’re only about 20 years away from people needing to install CO2 scrubbers in their homes. Soda lime, or calcium hydroxide, is the current state of the art. We use that in an anesthesia and in saltwater aquariums and in scuba rebreathers. An idealized system can capture 500 mg per gram, but in practice you only capture around 250mg/g. This outperforms the method in the article but it’s…

> The ease of releasing CO2 is the key advantage of the new compound. I have no idea why the journalist that wrote this article choose to highlight the carbon density of the sub-header. It's almost completely irrelevant for carbon capture plants. Another clear benefit is that it's a liquid. Today people mostly use the substances that you called non-reversible in research plants (AFAIK, all plants are research right n…

> perfectly reversible, but that uses a lot of energy

Looks like a perfect match to a solar plant, which provides basically free energy periodically. All you need is a large enough cistern to hold the liquid during night time.

Re: Efficient method to capture carbon dioxide from the atmosphere

#128

Post by aaronblohowiak »

jmward01 wrote: post #114

I am not against doing research in this area, please do, it is interesting and likely has many applications but global CO2 removal isn't one of them. Nothing proposed, including this, is within any orders of magnitude of a viable solution. The only solution we have is put less in the air in the first place. This tech looks interesting for transporting CO2 but that doesn't mean it sequesters it and even if sequestrati…

We need this even if emissions went to zero overnight. World is a big place, can do more than one thing at a time.

Re: Efficient method to capture carbon dioxide from the atmosphere

#129

Post by ctoth »

ctoth wrote: post #124
jmward01 wrote: post #114

I am not against doing research in this area, please do, it is interesting and likely has many applications but global CO2 removal isn't one of them. Nothing proposed, including this, is within any orders of magnitude of a viable solution. The only solution we have is put less in the air in the first place. This tech looks interesting for transporting CO2 but that doesn't mean it sequesters it and even if sequestrati…

> If we don't have the political will to reduce the amount going into the air then what makes anyone think we would have the political will to build out some system to capture and sequester? Because political will requires coordination, building systems and turning them on doesn't have to! > We need to focus more on not putting CO2 into the air and less on trying to take it out. What part of the "we" in this coordina…

The implicit model in "just emit less" is that human coordination problems are easier than engineering problems. That's historically backwards. We're extremely good at building things. We're terrible at getting everyone to sacrifice simultaneously for diffuse future benefits. Please generalize this!

Re: Efficient method to capture carbon dioxide from the atmosphere

#130

Post by maddmann »

jmward01 wrote: post #114

I am not against doing research in this area, please do, it is interesting and likely has many applications but global CO2 removal isn't one of them. Nothing proposed, including this, is within any orders of magnitude of a viable solution. The only solution we have is put less in the air in the first place. This tech looks interesting for transporting CO2 but that doesn't mean it sequesters it and even if sequestrati…

Unfortunately, Technological solutions are more politically feasible than attempting to reduce via restrictions and regulations that require intense global coordination that does not exist.
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