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Ryanair fined €256M over ‘abusive strategy’ to limit ticket sales by OTAs

theguardian.com

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Re: Ryanair fined €256M over ‘abusive strategy’ to limit ticket sales by OTAs

#211

Post by tehjoker »

tgsovlerkhgsel wrote: post #156
tehjoker wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even in that quote 2% of people are possibly scammed out of their money, which is probably tens or hundreds of thousands of people.

An unknown percentage of people actually want the insurance. If only 2% bought it despite such an extreme dark pattern, the 98-percentile of customers is much better than I would have expected.

It's true you don't know who wants it, but I thought capitalism was supposed to work by mutual consent and transparency of contract. If even one person is deceived, that's a scam! I doubt out of tens or hundreds of thousands of people all of them figured this out and wanted the insurance.

Re: Ryanair fined €256M over ‘abusive strategy’ to limit ticket sales by OTAs

#212

Post by lentil_soup »

scottyah wrote: post #197
lentil_soup wrote: post #167

What's going on on this thread? why are so many people defending Ryanair? I understand it's cheap and you get what you pay for but to defend this race to the bottom and scammy UX is so weird. Why do we need to simp for companies like this? It's great to have cheap options but we can also expect more from life. I'm sure we all here know how to navigate the dark patterns on the website but millions of people don't, so…

Yes, especially for a short flight I do not have high expectations. I don't want to be charged an extra $10 so I can get a "free" half sized water bottle or tea hat's been brewing since the late 90s. I don't need extra baggage, legroom, or any of the other add-ons that other airlines try to provide and charge for. I don't love the dark patterns, but believe the CEO when he says they are basically traps that enable th…

> I don't love the dark patterns, but believe the CEO when he says they are basically traps that enable the low prices for the people that don't fall for them.

I don't know what to respond to this. Are you saying you're fine with other people falling for the dark patterns if that allows for a cheaper ticket for you?

Re: Ryanair fined €256M over ‘abusive strategy’ to limit ticket sales by OTAs

#213

Post by 542354234235 »

kalleboo wrote: post #111
clan wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Almost. To such a degree I would call it a very dark pattern. There is however one very good argument for. Currencies with very high volatility. Think extreme inflation. If you accept their conversion you know what you pay in your own currency. You have then mitigated a risk. If your own currency is volatile then you might gamble and win. If the foreign currency is volatile you will usually win by paying in the forei…

Historically (like, 15+ years ago when I did the SEA backpacking circuit) there have been some cards with ridiculous fees for international transactions. Like, a flat $10 per transaction. Back then when I saw prompts like this on card terminals I assumed it was targeted at those cardholders (or people who had heard stories of those and were unsure and worried what they would be charged and wanted to be reassured by a…

Just so everyone is aware, it is still considered a foreign transaction regardless of which option you pick. So if you are using a card that charges for that, then you will be charged a foreign transaction fee. It is a foreign transaction fee, not foreign currency fee.

Re: Ryanair fined €256M over ‘abusive strategy’ to limit ticket sales by OTAs

#214

Post by arjie »

harrybr wrote: post #147
arethuza wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ryanair used to do some things that were quite remarkably devious - the option to not by travel insurance was in the middle of drop-down list of countries! To make sure I had remembered that correctly I looked it up and here is a description of it: https://www.insurancetimes.co.uk/ryanair-to-change-hidden-tr... NB I've travelled with Ryanair quite a lot and actually don't mind the actual flights but it is wise to man…

I have this example archived. Screenshots and explanation here: https://old.deceptive.design/trick_questions/ Conference video showing this example from 2010: https://youtu.be/zaubGV2OG5U?si=8PkLWhxHFSGQWuWw&t=597

Cool website. It’s a pity it’s no longer a wiki. Perhaps if you used the extension RequestAccount with a restriction of editing to only confirmed users you would be able to keep it a wiki.

Re: Ryanair fined €256M over ‘abusive strategy’ to limit ticket sales by OTAs

#215

Post by 542354234235 »

dcminter wrote: post #24
maccard wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m not defending this behaviour with Ryanair, but this is not unique to them at all. It’s an industry “standard”. I’m Irish but live in the UK - when we make card transactions it asks what currency we want to pay in, and hides the exchange rate spread. > I will only use them if I have literally no other choice Even with the £20 increase they were likely cheaper than the alternative, if it exists. If this is going to…

To be clear, the currency scam was a last straw, not the major dark pattern. When you compare list prices for flights with them versus almost any other airline you are comparing apples with oranges. The only way to figure out exactly what you'll pay is to go through the entirety of their checkout procedure. My experiences with those other airlines for short haul flights are quite different.

I also hate that it continues through the whole flight. I don't want to find out I have to pay to have my boarding pass printed, or that I need to pay for a glass of water on the plane. The other carrier might be more, but the things that come in the bundled fare make the trip easier with less friction points.

Re: Ryanair fined €256M over ‘abusive strategy’ to limit ticket sales by OTAs

#216

Post by aiiotnoodle »

mdhb wrote: post #195
blell wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just the fact that people can’t talk on the phone whilst on a plane makes it infinitely better than a bus.

Do you not own a pair of headphones?

Having been trapped on a 2 day flight to Madeira via Madrid, Porto and Porto Santo, eventually your powerbanks and headphones run out of charge.

EU621 comp was denied because the aircraft could not land due to wind.

I did spend about 12 hours in a fancy all inclusive on ryanair's dime (a bus arrived at the airport un-announced to the airport staff or us customers) while some slept in airbnbs and on the floor.

Re: Ryanair fined €256M over ‘abusive strategy’ to limit ticket sales by OTAs

#217

Post by SoftTalker »

andrepd wrote: post #201
RankingMember wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What really pisses me off is that this stuff is annoying and sometimes fools us , tech savvy people on a hacker forum. I can't imagine how many elderly/non-techie people are being fleeced out of their money because of these kind of dark patterns.

In 2025 it's decidedly old-fashioned to even think of interfering with the march of the orphan-crushing profit-maximising machine. Each quarter demands a fresh way to rip off people. How quaint even the 90s seem today, and we though that was hyper capitalism!

You don't think people were ripping each other off in the '90s?

How old a saying is caveat emptor?

Re: Ryanair fined €256M over ‘abusive strategy’ to limit ticket sales by OTAs

#218

Post by ruszki »

scottyah wrote: post #194
lmc wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No one is being forced do fly with them Sometimes they are the only option :-/

Did they eliminate the competition because people chose them over the other providers, or are they the only option because no other airline chose to offer that flight segment?

It’s not that simple. I’ve seen several routes where ultra low cost carriers simply lost against normal airlines. Especially when there are multiple airports in a given city, they often loose at usable airports. For example in Brussels.

Re: Ryanair fined €256M over ‘abusive strategy’ to limit ticket sales by OTAs

#219

Post by fennecbutt »

andy99 wrote: post #8
dcminter wrote: post #4

"O’Leary accused the travel agent industry of scamming and ripping off unsuspecting consumers by charging extra fees and markups on ticket prices." That is ... pretty rich. A couple of years ago I was going to go see my brother in the UK who lived near Stansted. As such Ryanair would have been the most convenient airline. The shere number of dark patterns I encountered trying to book the ticket was such that when I g…

> they tried to coax me into using my local currency instead of GBP and hid a £20 spread I’m finding this more and more. Uber does it, and even Walgreens does it when I’m in the US and tap my card it suggests that I pay in my home currency. This seems to be a new vector companies have found for ripping off their customers.

I mean American companies have done the "$1000, well that's also £1000 then!" bullshit for ages.

Re: Ryanair fined €256M over ‘abusive strategy’ to limit ticket sales by OTAs

#220

Post by [deleted] »

kalleboo wrote: post #111
clan wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Almost. To such a degree I would call it a very dark pattern. There is however one very good argument for. Currencies with very high volatility. Think extreme inflation. If you accept their conversion you know what you pay in your own currency. You have then mitigated a risk. If your own currency is volatile then you might gamble and win. If the foreign currency is volatile you will usually win by paying in the forei…

Historically (like, 15+ years ago when I did the SEA backpacking circuit) there have been some cards with ridiculous fees for international transactions. Like, a flat $10 per transaction. Back then when I saw prompts like this on card terminals I assumed it was targeted at those cardholders (or people who had heard stories of those and were unsure and worried what they would be charged and wanted to be reassured by a…

[deleted]
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