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US destroying its reputation as a scientific leader – European science diplomat

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Re: US destroying its reputation as a scientific leader – European science diplomat

#61

All I can say is let us all hope this is merely the American decade of humiliation and not the beginning of the American century of humiliation.

[flagged]

The greatest era of prosperity expansion and peace in world history courtesy of pax Americana. The best decades - measurably - for humanity overall have taken place since the US assumed that role post WW2.

Re: US destroying its reputation as a scientific leader – European science diplomat

#62

All I can say is let us all hope this is merely the American decade of humiliation and not the beginning of the American century of humiliation.

I hope it’s like what happened to countries like England, France, and Spain. You see your empire collapse but the country itself remains intact.

England “gave up” scientific and technological leadership during the 20th century. (That’s a tongue-in-cheek take on it, don’t read too much into it.)

Re: US destroying its reputation as a scientific leader – European science diplomat

#63
It is pretty much clear that the current WH has decided science has a bias against them and wants to curb it. There is no reason apart from that.

People still bring in bad faith arguments about private companies funding research or replication crisis. Sure these are big issues in current scientific research. There is no denying that.

While there might be an intuitive sense of less public research means money saved, there is no data or research (duh!) showing the impact of reduced public research.

From what we have seen so far this will make things worse - because for one private research is going to biased. It happens today but public research can counter that. Later there will be no defense. Like MAHA report making up BS sources using AI to push its agenda.

The irony in all of this is - the man pushing ivermectin during a pandemic - one of the biggest replication issue if not the big one - is telling others how to do research and people are defending him.

Re: US destroying its reputation as a scientific leader – European science diplomat

#64
post #22

It sounds more like a parroting of a popular sentiment as a conclusion, rather than providing a data-based assessment. What are the numbers? What's the real impact? How much lead does USA have over it's nearest competition?

That's the thing about investing in scientific research, especially toward the basic science end of the spectrum - the real benefit is seen years down the line after technology transfer to public-private partnerships and private industry. It can take many years to decades to see the long-term benefit, which is why it needs government backing. It's not sustainable for most players in the private sector to invest research that is high risk (with respect to applicability), long term, or both. This also makes it easy to cast doubt on the value of research being done now or recently - we don't have a ton of concrete results to show for it yet. The best numbers to look at would probably be emigration / immigration of PhDs, papers published in top-tier journals and the universities associated with them, and where conferences are being held.

Re: US destroying its reputation as a scientific leader – European science diplomat

#65
post #54

It's not just science, all sorts of conferences and other group gatherings are actively avoiding meeting in the US to avoid difficulties for international travelers.

[flagged]

But how does a person know if they are a piece of shit, according to CBP, or not? Might just skip the trip altogether and have less things to worry about.

Re: US destroying its reputation as a scientific leader – European science diplomat

#66
post #22

It sounds more like a parroting of a popular sentiment as a conclusion, rather than providing a data-based assessment. What are the numbers? What's the real impact? How much lead does USA have over it's nearest competition?

For the year ending May 2024, China released more scientific papers -in English- than the US [1]. We have been on a decline for a while.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_number_of...

[edit] I think that list is total, not just for a single year. Still telling though.

Re: US destroying its reputation as a scientific leader – European science diplomat

#67
post #54

It's not just science, all sorts of conferences and other group gatherings are actively avoiding meeting in the US to avoid difficulties for international travelers.

[flagged]

The problem is that the current government's idea of being a piece of shit politically includes any sort of dissent, disagreement, or mocking of the administration (see the people who have gotten in trouble for JD Vance memes)

Re: US destroying its reputation as a scientific leader – European science diplomat

#68
post #33
post #22

It sounds more like a parroting of a popular sentiment as a conclusion, rather than providing a data-based assessment. What are the numbers? What's the real impact? How much lead does USA have over it's nearest competition?

[flagged]

>Seems like a lot of people were getting a lot of easy money, and now they are unhappy.

who? can you be more specific than your generic "scientists" response?

Re: US destroying its reputation as a scientific leader – European science diplomat

#69
post #52

I'm OOTL, but there _is_ a ton of waste when it comes to money we give out. The article itself even says here: > [...] the US government has cut scientific grants to academics working on diversity-related topics, halted biomedical grants to international partners, and demanded universities shut down academic units that “belittle” conservative ideas [...] I'd say it's fair to question if taxpayers should be paying for…

It wasn't very welcoming in the 90s either.

Re: US destroying its reputation as a scientific leader – European science diplomat

#70
post #54

It's not just science, all sorts of conferences and other group gatherings are actively avoiding meeting in the US to avoid difficulties for international travelers.

[flagged]

The reality of any extra difficulty does not matter, the perception and response are the reality we deal with
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