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Firefox will have an option to disable all AI features

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Re: Firefox will have an option to disable all AI features

#351

Post by darkwater »

rockskon wrote: post #337
darkwater wrote: post #333

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"why do I have to go and fill with copy paste that form or navigate through that page to do $something if that AI browser can do it for me?" And in that scenario, there is a GIGANTIC need for a user-first, privacy-respecting browser using ideally local models (in a few years, when HW is ready)

Again: ??????? You people need to be forced to use your product in the exact form your product is presented to end users. With the exact frequency it's presented to end users. In all the wrong places as it is presented to end users. Maybe then you'll understand why shoving AI in every conceivable crevice is incredibly obnoxious and distracting and, most importantly, not useful .

Shoving an AI agent in every website is distracting and not that useful. Shoving an AI agent in every app is distracting as well.

Having one global AI agent per operating system or browser (where most of the digital life happens, in the case of desktop browsers), for the people that want to have an AI agent, it's probably going to be useful, if well implemented.

Re: Firefox will have an option to disable all AI features

#352

Post by chironjit »

samschooler wrote: post #23

I'm going to chime in here, I think 1. This is great and Mozilla is listening to it's core fans and 2. I want Firefox to be a competitive browser. Without AI enabled features + agent mode being first class citizens, this will be a non-starter in 2 years. I want my non-tech family members/friends to install Firefox not because I come over at Christmas, but because they want to. Because it's a browser that "just works.…

I'm surprised your take is so controversial. This really is it - yes, the current core users are not interested in AI but most people in our lives who are not techies do use them, and Firefox needs win these users if it wants to stay relevant.

Of course, I have opinions on other ways it could make money instead of jumping on the latest hot thing (pocket, fakespot, VPN, etc) without actually truly building the ecosystem but at least they are trying.

Re: Firefox will have an option to disable all AI features

#353

Post by alerighi »

sigmar wrote: post #178
MisterTea wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Do you ever need a website you're visiting translated? Yes. Firefox and Chrome already offer this. > Have you ever not understood a term or phrase on a website and had to go to wikipedia/urbandictionary/google to explain it? Yeah. And? > Have you ever wanted to do a 'fuzzy search' of a 300 page document (where you don't know the exact string of text to ctrl-f, but want to see where they talk about a particular topi…

>Yes. Firefox and Chrome already offer this. yes, both use machine learning methods to translate pages. You're already using AI and don't realize it.

Nowadays they call AI everything. Browsers translate websites from decades, when AI was only a word you would see in science fiction movies.

Re: Firefox will have an option to disable all AI features

#354

Post by bondarchuk »

heavyset_go wrote: post #297
protocolture wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly why I am baffled. You would think they could read the writing on the wall.

I don't like it, but ChatGPT is a product that nearly a billion people are using. It's broken into popular culture. My mom, who has trouble sending an email, uses it. She found it on her own. More importantly, generative AI is incredibly popular with younger cohorts. They will grow up to be your customer base if they aren't already. Their expectations are being set now . Again, I don't like it, but that's the reality…

Video games are incredibly popular and my mom plays them, does that mean Firefox should have video games baked in at the base layer?

Re: Firefox will have an option to disable all AI features

#355

Post by tliltocatl »

I think people screaming "but AI is the future" doesn't recognize what the problem is. The problem is not AI. The problem is that Mozilla keeps jumping on fads instead of focusing on their browser core. There are a tons of "we bundled all the latest crap" Chrome forks out there. Nobody needs more those. Stop pushing bells and whistles. Give us more extensibility instead. Keep supporting v2 manifest and add more. There were genuine technical reasons for why XUL and NPAPI had to die, but we need an equally powerful alternative.

And yea, having a faint through about removing adblock support, yet alone speaking it aloud is a really bad sign for Mozilla's future.

Re: Firefox will have an option to disable all AI features

#356

Post by Spacecosmonaut »

klardotsh wrote: post #319
samschooler wrote: post #23

I'm going to chime in here, I think 1. This is great and Mozilla is listening to it's core fans and 2. I want Firefox to be a competitive browser. Without AI enabled features + agent mode being first class citizens, this will be a non-starter in 2 years. I want my non-tech family members/friends to install Firefox not because I come over at Christmas, but because they want to. Because it's a browser that "just works.…

Fully disagree. I use zero so-called "AI" features in my day to day life. None. Not one. Why do I need them in my browser, and why does my browser need to focus on something that, several years into the hype wave, I still *do not use at all*? And it's not for a lack of trying, the results are just not what I need or want, and traditional browsing (and search engines, etc.) does do what I want. I'd be elated if Firefo…

AI tools are here to stay. They will start to creep into everything, everywhere, all the time. Either you recognize the moment at which it becomes a significant disadvantage not to use them (I agree that moment is not now), or get left behind.

Re: Firefox will have an option to disable all AI features

#357

Post by 7bit »

therouwboat wrote: post #342
heavyset_go wrote: post #297

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't like it, but ChatGPT is a product that nearly a billion people are using. It's broken into popular culture. My mom, who has trouble sending an email, uses it. She found it on her own. More importantly, generative AI is incredibly popular with younger cohorts. They will grow up to be your customer base if they aren't already. Their expectations are being set now . Again, I don't like it, but that's the reality…

Co-worker was talking about how he tried to make invitation card with chatgpt, just a picture of his house and text and AI failed to do it. It said he didn't have copyright to the picture and used another random pic, layout was wrong etc. Then younger co-worker gave tips how to do it, what tools to use and offered to make it with his better AI program. What could be done in few minutes with a free program is now mult…

Obviously your co-worker was not able to do it in a few minutes with a free program, or he would just have done it this way.

Re: Firefox will have an option to disable all AI features

#358

Post by TonyStr »

CodeCompost wrote: post #330

Can we please stop calling LLMs "AI"? It's obvious now that there is no intelligence here and no trying to make it talk to itself and call is "reasoning" is not the answer.

Nope, it's too late. It sounded stupid when they called it AI in the start, but now AI means something like "tools that can perform tasks that typically requires human faculties to complete". Just like a computer does more than compute, words change meaning, sometimes influenced by marketing.

Re: Firefox will have an option to disable all AI features

#359

Post by neobrain »

jamesgill wrote: post #93
HelloUsername wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why not make them disabled by default, with the option to turn them on? "All AI features will also be opt-in"

He said there would be both an "AI kill switch" but that it's also "opt-in". Taken together, his two statements seem a little...odd.

People are already getting worked up about being prompted to opt into a new feature on update (even if that prompt is hidden behind an icon that doesn't do anything until the user clicks it), so it's not inconceivable that the kill switch just disables those opt-in prompts for AI-related features.

Re: Firefox will have an option to disable all AI features

#360

Post by echelon »

tliltocatl wrote: post #355

I think people screaming "but AI is the future" doesn't recognize what the problem is. The problem is not AI. The problem is that Mozilla keeps jumping on fads instead of focusing on their browser core. There are a tons of "we bundled all the latest crap" Chrome forks out there. Nobody needs more those. Stop pushing bells and whistles. Give us more extensibility instead. Keep supporting v2 manifest and add more. Ther…

> people screaming "but AI is the future"

I witnes far more people screaming against AI.

The media started kicking this off in 2021, 2022. It blossomed into a fully distributed, organic, memetic device from there. It has a life of its own now.

Children and young people are practically indoctrinated if you look at social media comments.

I was invited to give lectures to several art schools about using Blender, Unreal Engine, and mocap software with diffusion models. The students weren't very polite. Most of the "questions" I got at each of the campuses were simply statements of affirmation about how much they hate AI.

Good looking and well-reviewed indie games that incorporate AI elements or tools are dumped on by these folks. It's like butting into conversations to say something bad about AI scores points or something.

> Mozilla keeps jumping on fads

Agreed on this point, though. They're rudderless. And Google is probably quite happy about the fact that their antitrust litigation sponge can't steal away their users.

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