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Using TypeScript to obtain one of the rarest license plates

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Re: Using TypeScript to obtain one of the rarest license plates

#71

Post by ruined »

SR2Z wrote: post #56
embedding-shape wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Never heard about it myself before, and went to Wikipedia of course, and found this: > Prison labor in the US is mostly optional. Although inmates are paid for their labor in most states, they usually receive less than $1 per hour. As of 2017, Arkansas, Georgia, and Texas did not pay inmates for any work whether inside the prison (such as custodial work and food services) or in state-owned businesses. Additionally, A…

> It sounds like it isn't optional everywhere, the pay is beyond inhuman, they don't always get any benefits at all, no training, don't safety and are overworked. Most of these are true, but I would push back on the pay angle. If a person is in jail, they are a ward of the state and have no expenses at all. There is no sense in paying them a "living wage" because they don't have to live off it. In any case, most ster…

>If a person is in jail, they are a ward of the state and have no expenses at all. There is no sense in paying them a "living wage" because they don't have to live off it. In any case, most stereotypical prison jobs would not cover the cost of incarcerating the employee.

only the last sentence here is true.

https://www.brennancenter.org/our-work/analysis-opinion/amer...

many prisoners receive a bill for their incarceration and will come out of prison with debt, even if they're working while in prison.

it varies prison to prison, but even basic toiletries may not be provided. the most commonly purchased items at commissary are food.

> The US definitely puts too many people in prison, but that's for cultural reasons and not because of some nefarious plan to get cheap labor.

the constitutional amendment abolishing slavery contains a single exception: prisoners.

the largest maximum security prison in the united states is a slave plantation, operated continuously since the 1830s. they still farm cotton.

Re: Using TypeScript to obtain one of the rarest license plates

#72

Post by FroshKiller »

komali2 wrote: post #43

I swear I read some case a couple years back where a kid was facing serious prison time for automating requests to w publicly available government website. "Unauthorized access of a computer." I think the author may have just admitted to what the government considers a serious federal crime, as stupid as it is to consider it a crime.

I was charged with felony unauthorized access of a government computer years ago for an even stupider reason. Nobody should underestimate the state's willingness to prosecute over anything.

Re: Using TypeScript to obtain one of the rarest license plates

#73

Post by btilly »

embedding-shape wrote: post #36
danvayn wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They can say no. These Prisons incentivize inmates to opt in by claiming that prisoners develop employable marketable skills and that the work leaves a a good mark on their record. It can also pay out cents to a few dollars an hour (or nothing at all) It’s not quite slave labor but it probably should be compensated better at the minimum.

Never heard about it myself before, and went to Wikipedia of course, and found this: > Prison labor in the US is mostly optional. Although inmates are paid for their labor in most states, they usually receive less than $1 per hour. As of 2017, Arkansas, Georgia, and Texas did not pay inmates for any work whether inside the prison (such as custodial work and food services) or in state-owned businesses. Additionally, A…

All true, but on the flip side they get free room and board...

Joking aside, read the 13th amendment https://constitution.congress.gov/constitution/amendment-13/ and pay close attention to the bit that reads, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted. In the United States, involuntary labor, slavery, and locking someone in a cell are all equally not allowed. And all equally allowed - as punishment for crimes of which you have been convicted.

If you think that this is ripe for abuse, you'd be exactly right. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Convict_leasing. We got rid of chattel slavery - and immediately accomplished the same effect with the black codes and convict leasing. As the name suggests, this was overwhelmingly directed at the same black people who had just theoretically been emancipated.

Re: Using TypeScript to obtain one of the rarest license plates

#74

Post by jfindper »

komali2 wrote: post #43

I swear I read some case a couple years back where a kid was facing serious prison time for automating requests to w publicly available government website. "Unauthorized access of a computer." I think the author may have just admitted to what the government considers a serious federal crime, as stupid as it is to consider it a crime.

The fun thing about the computer fraud and abuse act is that just about anything can be made into a federal crime with it!

Re: Using TypeScript to obtain one of the rarest license plates

#75

Post by kelnos »

reactordev wrote: post #60
MangoToupe wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even our legal system recognizes it as slave labor. The thirteenth amendment specifically says: "neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction."

yes but except as a punishment for crime whereof has been refined with further case law I believe. You can be forced to do small jobs, clean up. You can be assigned Road Crew and pickup trash. You can do small jobs that the system won't hire and pay for, they'll use you. So long as you aren't a risk of flight, to the officers, or to society if you have to interact with the public. Beats sitting in a cinderblock white…

> Beats sitting in a cinderblock white-painted cell with a metal cot and 4" mattress.

Does it, though? One might prefer that over slave labor.

Re: Using TypeScript to obtain one of the rarest license plates

#76

Post by qingcharles »

danvayn wrote: post #29
embedding-shape wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yes, it’s borderline slave labor I'm sorry, how is it "borderline" slave labour and not straight up forced labour? These people are imprisoned, and I'm assuming forced to do this work, or what happens if they say no? It's quite literally known as "penal labour" and I thought most of the world figured out that we're not supposed to treat people like that anymore.

They can say no. These Prisons incentivize inmates to opt in by claiming that prisoners develop employable marketable skills and that the work leaves a a good mark on their record. It can also pay out cents to a few dollars an hour (or nothing at all) It’s not quite slave labor but it probably should be compensated better at the minimum.

They certainly can say no in a lot of states, but that is often very much against the best interests of the prisoner because almost all work programs shorten your sentence.

I knew one guy who was doing a 30 day jail sentence for some misdemeanor and was told they would reduce it to 14 days if he worked in the kitchen. He took the job and lost most of his thumb in a very unsafe meat slicer. This put his 17 year career with UPS in jeopardy since the nerve damage made it hard for him to handle things.

Re: Using TypeScript to obtain one of the rarest license plates

#77

Post by lanyard-textile »

ahmeneeroe-v2 wrote: post #70
macintux wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they're in prison for a reason. Often that reason is "too poor to afford proper representation" or "looked vaguely like the actual criminal" or "took a plea bargain because the justice system was threatening them with an immorally-long wait for a trial and a likely worse outcome".

Often that reason is "committed a horrific violent crime"

Often it is.

Often it is not.

Often, they too are a victim of our judicial system, and we can't just ignore them due to the peers we locked them in with.

Re: Using TypeScript to obtain one of the rarest license plates

#78

Post by qingcharles »

btilly wrote: post #73
embedding-shape wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Never heard about it myself before, and went to Wikipedia of course, and found this: > Prison labor in the US is mostly optional. Although inmates are paid for their labor in most states, they usually receive less than $1 per hour. As of 2017, Arkansas, Georgia, and Texas did not pay inmates for any work whether inside the prison (such as custodial work and food services) or in state-owned businesses. Additionally, A…

All true, but on the flip side they get free room and board... Joking aside, read the 13th amendment https://constitution.congress.gov/constitution/amendment-13/ and pay close attention to the bit that reads, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted . In the United States, involuntary labor, slavery, and locking someone in a cell are all equally not allowed. And all equally al…

It's not free everywhere. Many institutions in the USA charge you for your stay. You can stay in jail for a year and have the case dismissed and still be on the hook for thousands of dollars in rent.

Re: Using TypeScript to obtain one of the rarest license plates

#79

Post by kelnos »

ahmeneeroe-v2 wrote: post #70
macintux wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they're in prison for a reason. Often that reason is "too poor to afford proper representation" or "looked vaguely like the actual criminal" or "took a plea bargain because the justice system was threatening them with an immorally-long wait for a trial and a likely worse outcome".

Often that reason is "committed a horrific violent crime"

Not really? I mean, when you compare the number of people who have committed a "horrific violent" crime to the total number of people caught up in the US prison system, I expect it's not "often".

Re: Using TypeScript to obtain one of the rarest license plates

#80

Post by qingcharles »

reactordev wrote: post #60
MangoToupe wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even our legal system recognizes it as slave labor. The thirteenth amendment specifically says: "neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction."

yes but except as a punishment for crime whereof has been refined with further case law I believe. You can be forced to do small jobs, clean up. You can be assigned Road Crew and pickup trash. You can do small jobs that the system won't hire and pay for, they'll use you. So long as you aren't a risk of flight, to the officers, or to society if you have to interact with the public. Beats sitting in a cinderblock white…

Yes, you don't need to be convicted to be forced into labor under the 13th. Pretrial detainees can be forced to do "housekeeping chores" and not violate the constitution.
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