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Mozilla appoints new CEO Anthony Enzor-Demeo

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Re: Mozilla appoints new CEO Anthony Enzor-Demeo

#741

Post by godelski »

avazhi wrote: post #709
godelski wrote: post #405

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Image search? I have a search engine for that. I'd use it. Why does it need to be another site? I'd trust Mozilla more than I trust Google. Do you really feel different? Plus, Search by Image[0] is one of the most popular extensions, with 3x as many people using it as tree-style tabs. I don't use it but a grammar tool is the next most popular[1], so I could see this being quite a useful feature. But the other stuff…

But that’s exactly my point - addons already solve these problems without baking them in natively. Adding AI just creates bloatware/privacy/security/maintenance problems that are already solved by users being able to customise the browser for their own needs.

I do get that and I'm like 60% with you, but I'm just saying that it is easy to get a bit in a bubble and Mozilla needs to cater to the average person. And let's be honest, we aren't the average user.

Personally I'm fine as long as it continues to be easy to disable and remove. Yeah, I'd rather it be opt-in instead of opt-out but it's not a big price to pay to avoid giving Chrome more power over the internet. At the end of the day these issues are pretty small fish in comparison.

Re: Mozilla appoints new CEO Anthony Enzor-Demeo

#742

Post by sudokatsu »

SoftTalker wrote: post #204
dbdr wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For one, being childless is a choice (mostly, especially since adoption is a possibility). It's indeed OK to have different opinions for what how laws apply differently to people based on their choices. Being gay is not a choice, it is rather similar to race/ethnic background, and it's generally not OK to have laws that treat people differently based on something like that. I'm sure there are more nuances to add, but…

I don't think everyone agrees that being gay is not a choice. There are no outward physical indicators of a person's sexual orientation. It's entirely behavorial and therefore plausibly under the conscious control of the person. Now, I would agree that a person doesn't choose which gender he is attracted to, but it not something than anyone else can see and immediately understand as an inborn characteristic. Clearly…

This is the craziest example of “if I can’t see it, it [might not] exist” I have ever witnessed.

Re: Mozilla appoints new CEO Anthony Enzor-Demeo

#743

Post by komali2 »

avazhi wrote: post #706
tigroferoce wrote: post #600

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Live captions and dubbing can be a game changer for: - non native speakers - moving away from the english-centric web - impaired people

Couldn’t care less about any of that. English is the world’s dominant language and will remain so for the foreseeable future. There’s nothing wrong with that. And subtitles exist already or can be generated by addons. Most people don’t use them. So, once again, maybe don’t inconvenience the vast majority of users for some small subset of the population.

> English is the world’s dominant language and will remain so for the foreseeable future.

Based on the fact that you said this I'm going to assume you can't read/write Mandarin, apologies if that's incorrect because that leads to my second assumption which is that you're unaware of the astonishingly vast amount of content and conversation related to open source and AI/ML you're missing out on as a result of not being able to read/write Mandarin.

Re: Mozilla appoints new CEO Anthony Enzor-Demeo

#745

Post by nathanlied »

komali2 wrote: post #702
array_key_first wrote: post #539

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> Basically every product Mozilla releases is immediately met with extreme scourn and scepticism. While everyone else seems to get the benefit of the doubt, including the likes of Google, Mozilla seems to get the exact opposite of that. I've been thinking about this for a while, ever since The Framework DHH incident. Basically, framework sent DHH a free laptop and funded his ruby conference and "arch distro." DHH mea…

I'm by no means defending throwing the baby out with the bathwater - which is what's happening when someone abandons a less-aligned company for a completely unaligned one - but I have a somewhat different perspective on what, exactly, ticks these people off so much with Framework but not Dell, even though Dell is ostensibly worse (from their perspective), and it's not all that unreasonable emotionally, but it leads to bad outcomes, and it is very much not rational.

For them, it's a problem of (perceived) hypocrisy. You see, Dell never claimed to be good. Nor did HP. They're big corporations, they've got contracts with the military, IDF, what have you. Their appeal, as it were, is the product/service itself. Their only ideal is the Capital, and they never pretended otherwise.

In comes Framework; claiming to be sustainable, different from the others, caring about society/the world/etc., instead of just in it for the Capital, like all the others - regardless of whether they really claimed this or not, it is how they're perceived by these people - and then they go and "do something like that", so they go back to Dell/HP, because at least those didn't lie about who they were. This is exactly what happens with Mozilla vs Google/Microsoft.

This is very much a reflection of a fair few Leftist political spaces. Two people may agree on pretty much everything in how a society should be ran, but one of them believes that private property is inherently theft, and another one would like to maintain private property. That singular difference, one that could be set aside until all other goals are achieved - if ever - will cause endless debate, drama, and ultimately a schism which will leave both sides weaker.

Re: Mozilla appoints new CEO Anthony Enzor-Demeo

#746

Post by _heimdall »

mikestorrent wrote: post #725
_heimdall wrote: post #576

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wasn't webOS effectively an OS built on web standards and effectively just a browser engine? The Pre had 256MB and something like a 600mHZ processor. While it was no speed demon, I was always impressed with the animations and multitasking they pulled off with it.

People forget we used the web on 100mHz 486s with maybe 16MB of RAM and sites like Slashdot were plenty usable.

Granted sites like Slashdot didn't used react server components.

Re: Mozilla appoints new CEO Anthony Enzor-Demeo

#747

Post by rendaw »

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #672
wtallis wrote: post #591

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They literally forced every user to either accept the invasion of the proprietary service, or have to take extra steps to disable it on each of their devices. Neither of those is actually a reasonable, respectful way to treat your users.

How much are you paying, again?

Full price!

Re: Mozilla appoints new CEO Anthony Enzor-Demeo

#748

Post by throw10920 »

array_key_first wrote: post #539
wvh wrote: post #308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm still sad they shelved Mozilla Persona due to low adoption. There is a hole in the market around privacy and identity, and Mozilla would be a natural choice to fill it, but it's going to be an uphill battle to get major sites and end users on board. Not a job to be envious about indeed.

[flagged]

> It's damned if you do, damned if you don't. Basically every product Mozilla releases is immediately met with extreme scourn and scepticism. While everyone else seems to get the benefit of the doubt, including the likes of Google, Mozilla seems to get the exact opposite of that.

You have any evidence for this - that is, that the same subsets of users are being hard on Mozilla and soft on Google? Because that's pretty easy to quantify if you have evidence, which I notice you haven't presented.

Right now all you have is a gut feeling disguised as an factual claim about reality - which is worse than worthless because it's biased by your feelings, as opposed to being a wild guess.

Re: Mozilla appoints new CEO Anthony Enzor-Demeo

#749

Post by II2II »

wtallis wrote: post #676
moogly wrote: post #664

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Sure, living with the nuisance of the advertising and UI clutter is an option about:config extensions.pocket.enabled set to `false`. That's how hard that used to be.

Anything requiring messing with about:config is an unreasonable way to treat non-technical users. And the point I've already made that you're ignoring is that the complexity of the workaround is not the problem—the necessity of taking action to disable Pocket is what was most concerning about what Mozilla did.

I simply removed it from the toolbar, same as I did with the Firefox sync icon. Out of sight, out of mind. Granted, they were much more pushy about other features and services. Much less pushy than other vendors and it was, in some respects, understandable. (How do you convince people your product is relevant if they think it does less than the competition because they aren't aware of what's there?)

Re: Mozilla appoints new CEO Anthony Enzor-Demeo

#750

Post by safety1st »

wtallis wrote: post #674
kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #672

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How much are you paying, again?

Price is irrelevant. Mozilla's behavior with Pocket was at odds with Mozilla's stated goals and values.

The broader discussion but especially this little exchange reminds me of a similar situation with Ubuntu.

At one point they were the darling of the desktop Linux space and much beloved by an online community of highly principled people who didn't pay them anything.

Those same people then utterly blasted them when they tried a few monetization/promotion features that fell flat, like the Amazon lens in Unity. I had no love for that lens but it was easy to remove.

Shuttleworth gave a fairly telling interview afterwards which basically amounted to "Fuck these guys, you can never make them happy."

Canonical proceeded to focus on the server side where there's more money, fewer loud freeloaders, and now they're somewhat more evil.

There is also a whole strain of thought in SaaS which says don't ever have a free version because those guys always end up being the biggest complainers.

I think you have to accept that no company is going to get it 100% perfect and if you're too loud, annoying, and you're not giving them anything in return, they may just take their ball and go home.

Being the company that does the right thing is arguably not worth it, the devil's advocate argument is, some guy online is going to ride you even harder because you said you were trying to do the right thing, so better to stay quiet, or even cultivate an air of vague evil instead, then they won't bother.

Perhaps also related: the idea that riots are stupid, because rioters are inevitably protesting someone/something that's far away, even as they set fire to local businesses owned by members of their own community.

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