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Freeing a Xiaomi humidifier from the cloud

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Re: Freeing a Xiaomi humidifier from the cloud

#81

Post by DocTomoe »

somehnguy wrote: post #53
DocTomoe wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm all for KISS. But in a rare instance, xkcd is missing the point here. People do not live in their rooms 24/7, but they do want to be able to, e.g., turn stuff on or off remotely, or based on environmental conditions (turn on/off based on outside sensors or the current electricity price...) or to get status alerts ("tank empty, refill"). Now, I do that via Home Assistant and keep anything "smart" on a highly-restr…

I still think the value prop is dubious for a device like this. > turn stuff on or off remotely Why? Nearly all modern humidifiers have a sensor to measure humidity and will cycle on and off based on the setpoint. Getting to the setpoint also takes time so I don't see any reason someone would want to turn it on and off based on presence. > (turn on/off based on outside sensors or the current electricity price...) Not…

Hm, I have the opposite setup - I operate a dehumidifier. The building I live in gets humid quickly, and that causes mould quickly. My tank fills. When the tank is full (and, depending on outside conditions and number of humans present, that happens anytime between 16 and 40 hours), the device stops dehumidifying to prevent tank overflow.

Yes, I do still need to be present to empty the tank. But automated warnings when the tank is full (in combination with more intense 'room's LED lightbulb flashing red' when BOTH the tank is full AND humidity rises above 60%) are nice - otherwise, I'd have more mental load to check a little tiny LED on the device itself every two days or so, which, surprise, I would keep forgetting.

Why are outside sensors relevant in my use-case? Because running the dehumidifier is pointless when the window is open AND outside humidity exceeds inside humidity (and electricity is expensive where I live).

Secondary use-case: mould and 'rentee did not air out the humidity correctly' are some of the more common points of conflict between landlords and rentees over here. With my smart dehumidifier (and a few more sensors placed around the apartment and outside), I have a paper trail should this ever come in front of a judge that yes, in fact, I correctly fought humidity.

Is my use-case everyone's use-case? No. Am I probably over-engineering this? Sure, it's possible. Is it nice and kind to make broad paternalistic assumptions and snarky jokes on what and what not "anyone" really needs? Doubtful.

You're arguing from device capability. I’m arguing from human cognitive load and failure modes. The question isn't "can the (de)humidifier regulate humidity on its own?", but "how many low-level checks and mental reminders does it eliminate over months of use?". For people who forget, get distracted, or simply want fewer things to keep in mind, that's not dubious value - it's the entire point.

Re: Freeing a Xiaomi humidifier from the cloud

#82

Post by citrin_ru »

marcinpieczka wrote: post #51
piskov wrote: post #2

On a tangent note: don’t use ultrasonic humidifiers. Unless distilled water is used, they create a shit-ton of pm2.5 particles. Use evaporative humidifiers (just disks with myriads of small notches for water to cling on and a fan): https://us.smartmiglobal.com/pages/smartmi-evaporative-humid...

Are pm2.5 particles a problem if they are water soluble? After entering the body they will just dissolve.

Hard water often contains hard to dissolve minerals. An evaporative humidifier over the time accumulates limescale and it’s very difficult to remove it, you cannot just dissolve it. With ultrasound humidifier all this limescale will be in the air. Admittedly not in all regions the water is hard but if it is then ultrasound humidifier will be a bad choice.

Re: Freeing a Xiaomi humidifier from the cloud

#83

Post by mcsniff »

somehnguy wrote: post #53
DocTomoe wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm all for KISS. But in a rare instance, xkcd is missing the point here. People do not live in their rooms 24/7, but they do want to be able to, e.g., turn stuff on or off remotely, or based on environmental conditions (turn on/off based on outside sensors or the current electricity price...) or to get status alerts ("tank empty, refill"). Now, I do that via Home Assistant and keep anything "smart" on a highly-restr…

I still think the value prop is dubious for a device like this. > turn stuff on or off remotely Why? Nearly all modern humidifiers have a sensor to measure humidity and will cycle on and off based on the setpoint. Getting to the setpoint also takes time so I don't see any reason someone would want to turn it on and off based on presence. > (turn on/off based on outside sensors or the current electricity price...) Not…

It's a good thing personal choice exists and you don't make the rules for everyone.

> I don't see any reason someone would want to turn it on and off based on presence.

Maybe someone doesn't want the noise when they are present? Some people like white noise, some don't.

> The amount of electricity these take to run isn't worth even mentioning.

Not everyone lives where you do and pays the electricity rates you do. What about people who generate their own electricity, live off a grid, or just plain want to conserve energy for a myriad a reasons? Turning off specific loads based on XYZ is useful.

> So you can refill it remotely? You have to be present to fill it anyway - just look at the thing and you'll know its water level

Maybe the humidifier is in a low visible or less-trafficked area, and getting a reminder to fill it up would be useful.

What a terrible take you have on people's use case not exactly matching yours.

Re: Freeing a Xiaomi humidifier from the cloud

#84

Post by dangus »

piskov wrote: post #78
dangus wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The real pro tip is to get a whole home humidifier. They aren’t even that expensive. But I haven’t taken the plunge yet. They avoid all these issues and require way less maintenance than any other solution.

Can’t do that in the city :-)

I've seen multi-unit condos with the ability to modify your own HVAC, but I get where you're coming from.

Re: Freeing a Xiaomi humidifier from the cloud

#85

Post by Nextgrid »

skeledrew wrote: post #70

This got me thinking about how my AC is somewhat ticking me off. A couple years ago I bought a smart AC, and when I got around to wanting to use the smart feature (via the app), I learned that I need to create a Tuya account and connect via that. Today I'm still manually pushing the buttons, as I wasn't having any of that, and the community Tuya tools I found out there are dependent on an account. A couple weeks ago…

There is no danger of bricking the device by messing up a Tuya module firmware update; the module is always separate from the main device and communicates with it via a UART; even if you were to brick it the device would still work as a non-smart device.

Re: Freeing a Xiaomi humidifier from the cloud

#86

Post by skeledrew »

Nextgrid wrote: post #85
skeledrew wrote: post #70

This got me thinking about how my AC is somewhat ticking me off. A couple years ago I bought a smart AC, and when I got around to wanting to use the smart feature (via the app), I learned that I need to create a Tuya account and connect via that. Today I'm still manually pushing the buttons, as I wasn't having any of that, and the community Tuya tools I found out there are dependent on an account. A couple weeks ago…

There is no danger of bricking the device by messing up a Tuya module firmware update; the module is always separate from the main device and communicates with it via a UART; even if you were to brick it the device would still work as a non-smart device.

I see. Thanks for that.

Re: Freeing a Xiaomi humidifier from the cloud

#87

Post by devilbunny »

beachy wrote: post #62
esaym wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Use evaporative humidifiers You don't have to buy one either. A suspended wet towel with a fan blowing on it will work very well. If you want to get fancy, have the last inch or two of the towel sitting in a tray of water.

My brother's house in Perth, Australia has an antique air conditioning system in the roof space that works in exactly this principle. 4 blankets that wick up water and have air drawn through them and into the house by a fan. It's in disuse now but I understand they were common and quite effective in the day.

They're usually called "swamp coolers" and are very effective iff you have very low ambient humidity. Utterly useless in humid climates.

Re: Freeing a Xiaomi humidifier from the cloud

#88

Post by alsetmusic »

hs586 wrote: post #38

Tangential rant: It’s becoming hard to buy dumb appliances. I was looking at robot vacuums, and most need internet connection at least for setup - by which point it’s already uploaded your floor plan and who knows what to the cloud.

We got one this year. "Setup" meant pairing with our devices plus the account we had to create with the manufacturer. It didn't map the place until after that. I assume they all work this way.

Re: Freeing a Xiaomi humidifier from the cloud

#89

Post by einsteinx2 »

hs586 wrote: post #56
einsteinx2 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure that’s a great example when you can easily buy a regular vacuum. Robot vacuums are sort of by definition already the “smart appliance” version of the “dumb appliance regular vacuum”.

I understand what you mean, but I disagree. The technology allows for robot vacuums to exist and I don’t see the cloud connection as a mandatory need for it. Similarly, I want my car to have say lane assist but we don’t expect to have cloud connection with it.

That's a fair point. It's frustrating that practically every "smart" anything these days needs a cloud connection (and probably also an app) just to work when they could easily work offline.
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