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Icons in Menus Everywhere – Send Help

blog.jim-nielsen.com

41–50 of 340 posts

Re: Icons in Menus Everywhere – Send Help

#41
post #3

I always thought menus had icons so they could be matched to the same functionality on the toolbar. If a menu lacks an icon, then it's probably not on the toolbar. This falls apart when there is no toolbar. But I have definitely found an action in the menu, looked at the icon, and matched it to a a button elsewhere.

I believe some programs used to let you even drag menu items to the toolbar.

You made me feel old by saying "I believe".

Re: Icons in Menus Everywhere – Send Help

#42
post #36
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my language “egregious” means “very good”. In English means both very good and very bad. What’s your meaning here? Just to be consistent :)

In practice, "egregious" in English never means very good

It used to!

Re: Icons in Menus Everywhere – Send Help

#43
From an accessibility/localization stand point, icons+text everywhere seems to be ideal.

Also, I disagree with:

> This posture lends itself to a practice where designers have an attitude of “I need an icon to fill up this space”

Sure, that does technically happen, but is in no way preventative or mutually exclusive with the follow on thought:

> Does ... the cognitive load of parsing and understanding it, help or hurt how someone would use this menu system?

That still happens, because if they mismatch an icon with text, that can result in far worse cognitive load/misunderstanding than if no icon was present at all. This becomes readily apparent in his follow on thought experiment where you show someone a menu with icons+text, but "censor" the text. Icons+text is also superior to [occasionally icons]+text in the same thought experiment. From my perspective, the author just argued against their own preference there.

I'd argue that the thought process behind determining an appropriate icon is even more important and relevant when being consistent and enforcing icon+text everywhere, not diminished. It also has the broadest possible appeal (to the visual/graphically focused, to the literary focused, to those who either may not speak the language, and/or to those who are viewing the menu with a condensed/restrictive viewport that doesn't have room for the full text). Now, if the argument is predicated on "We aren't willing to pay a designer for this" then yeah, they have a point. Except they used Apple as an example so, doubt that was the premise.

Re: Icons in Menus Everywhere – Send Help

#44

I changed the UX in my mobile app from text only to icon + text by default in menus, buttons, and links. There are several reasons I made the switch, but the primary reason is that it makes it easier to build a kind of muscle memory for navigating and performing particular actions. In essence, the text is there for new users and the icons are there for experienced users.

It's kind of a shame how we keep trying to make icons look uniform, either in color, or in shape.

Like I open the app drawer on my Android phone and there are like 16 different icons, all different Google apps, all are round and various abstract configurations of the same exact four colors.

Feels like we're falling into the same trap that Gothic handwriting did with the minims. Yeah it looks very pretty but it's almost completely illegible since we've taken away all the things that help set icons apart. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minim_(palaeography)#/media/Fi...

Re: Icons in Menus Everywhere – Send Help

#45

I changed the UX in my mobile app from text only to icon + text by default in menus, buttons, and links. There are several reasons I made the switch, but the primary reason is that it makes it easier to build a kind of muscle memory for navigating and performing particular actions. In essence, the text is there for new users and the icons are there for experienced users.

I feel like shortcuts are often enough. They function quite like this: a symbolic language that allows you to build up an intuition. They use icons that you already know, and instead of being bespoke per designer (how many different save icons are there?) they work across your entire OS. The muscle memory you build, instead of being bespoke per menu (and dynamic in time), allows you to skip the menu entirely!

Re: Icons in Menus Everywhere – Send Help

#47
post #38

100% disagree. They make finding a group of commands very quickly and it's not like horizontal space in menu is at the premium

Maybe you misunderstood the author. They wrote: ‘ It’s not that I think menu items should never have icons. I think they can be incredibly useful. It’s more that I don’t like the idea of “give each menu item an icon” being the default approach. ’ The point is, if every item in a long menu has an icon, then they typically can’t all be very distinguishable and recognizable, and blur together visually. It creates more v…

But isn’t the second half of the article the author pointing out a bunch of menu examples from macOS Tahoe where some items have icons and others don’t and still coming to the conclusion that it’s confusing? How is that not a contradiction of the prior declaration?

Re: Icons in Menus Everywhere – Send Help

#48
post #29

Just right-click any file in VSCode/Cursor to see how absolutely chaotic and tedious a long menu is without icons. Now imagine that Google Docs example without icons. It’s much easier to recognize the funnel icon to make a filter, than to skim all that text.

MS Office only has icons for the things that matter most. I think MS even had a UI guideline similar to the one that is cited from apple in TFA, but I cannot find it.

The author doesn't ask for _no_ icons at all. So I really don't get this critique.

Intentionally omitting some icons is a really powerful tool to draw attention to the actions that the user wants to do most of the time. I think that pattern went away in some places because it looks more consistent (that doesn't mean that usability is better) and some designers have some kind of OCD. At least that's what I have experienced in that exact case.

Re: Icons in Menus Everywhere – Send Help

#49
post #29

Just right-click any file in VSCode/Cursor to see how absolutely chaotic and tedious a long menu is without icons. Now imagine that Google Docs example without icons. It’s much easier to recognize the funnel icon to make a filter, than to skim all that text.

[deleted]

Re: Icons in Menus Everywhere – Send Help

#50
>For example, the “Settings” menu item (third from the top) has an icon. But the other item in its grouping “Privacy Report” does not. I wonder why?

Isn't it obvious? Because compared to "Settings" it is a far less important infrequently used setting.

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