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NVIDIA frenemy relation with OpenAI and Oracle

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Re: NVIDIA frenemy relation with OpenAI and Oracle

#81

Post by Havoc »

Not a big fan of the circular observation. It's not the gotcha people seem to think.

If the baker sells bread to the butcher, and the butcher sells meat to the baker then they can still both go to bed with a belly full of sandwich (aka actual utility & substance).

Adding a third party to make it look more circle-y doesn't change that logic.

Round trip financing is mostly an issue if it is artificial (e.g. a circle of loans) and between affiliated parties, not when something of substance is delivered. Oracle is a business partner of nvidia but I'd wager they'll still kick up a fuss if they don't get their pallets of GB200s. They'll expect actual delivery...like you know...in a real sale.

Re: NVIDIA frenemy relation with OpenAI and Oracle

#82

Post by johnecheck »

throw234678 wrote: post #20

This post is written with its intellectual fly open. I'm not sure whether it was partly AI-generated, or whether the author has spent so much time ingesting AI-generated content that the tells have rubbed off, but this article has: - Strange paragraph-lists with bolded first words. e.g. "The Cash Flow Mystery" - The 'It's not just X; it's Y' meme: "Buying Groq wouldn't just [...], it could give them a chip that is ac…

> Even if the conclusion is broadly correct, that doesn't mean the reasoning used to get there is consistent.

This is the conclusion of a reply that focused entirely on critiquing OP's style/AI use instead of their reasoning? Ironic.

Re: NVIDIA frenemy relation with OpenAI and Oracle

#83

Post by johnfn »

throw234678 wrote: post #20

This post is written with its intellectual fly open. I'm not sure whether it was partly AI-generated, or whether the author has spent so much time ingesting AI-generated content that the tells have rubbed off, but this article has: - Strange paragraph-lists with bolded first words. e.g. "The Cash Flow Mystery" - The 'It's not just X; it's Y' meme: "Buying Groq wouldn't just [...], it could give them a chip that is ac…

It does amuse me when you have great, clean writing in some parts of a post, but then you have a sentence like

> As we head into 2026, when looking at Nvidia, openai and Oracle dynamics, it looks like they are squeezing each other balls.

Yeah I don't think there's a snowball's chance in heck that an LLM wrote that one, lol. My best guess is that the author combed over some of their prose with an LLM, but not all.

Re: NVIDIA frenemy relation with OpenAI and Oracle

#84

Post by throw234678 »

glitchc wrote: post #62
throw234678 wrote: post #20

This post is written with its intellectual fly open. I'm not sure whether it was partly AI-generated, or whether the author has spent so much time ingesting AI-generated content that the tells have rubbed off, but this article has: - Strange paragraph-lists with bolded first words. e.g. "The Cash Flow Mystery" - The 'It's not just X; it's Y' meme: "Buying Groq wouldn't just [...], it could give them a chip that is ac…

Why use a throwaway account if posting an honest critique?

1. I haven't commented on HN in a while and didn't want to dig up my password. Throwaway accounts are a tradition.

2. I don't want people to see my disparagement of the quality of prose in this article as indication of personal agreement or disagreement with any of the points in the article. I have no horse in this race. I just want to read high-quality material. I love HN, but I'm not sure how much longer HN will be a place I can frequent in this respect. Have the hills not eroded? What of childlike curiosity?

3. My comment is nothing special. Others also point out portions of this article may be AI generated. People can verify the contents of my comment independently and come to their own conclusions. It does not require that I lean on implied authority of some form.

I read a lot, it's basically all I do. I wish writers maintained the contract of spending at least as much energy writing out ideas as they expect their audience to expend while reading them.

I will now log out of this account and lose the password. I hope this was helpful. I intend no malice; I'm sure the author of this piece is a kind person and fun to hang out with. I hope they take this feedback the right way.

Re: NVIDIA frenemy relation with OpenAI and Oracle

#85

Post by throw234678 »

johnecheck wrote: post #82
throw234678 wrote: post #20

This post is written with its intellectual fly open. I'm not sure whether it was partly AI-generated, or whether the author has spent so much time ingesting AI-generated content that the tells have rubbed off, but this article has: - Strange paragraph-lists with bolded first words. e.g. "The Cash Flow Mystery" - The 'It's not just X; it's Y' meme: "Buying Groq wouldn't just [...], it could give them a chip that is ac…

> Even if the conclusion is broadly correct, that doesn't mean the reasoning used to get there is consistent. This is the conclusion of a reply that focused entirely on critiquing OP's style/AI use instead of their reasoning? Ironic.

Poe's Law strikes again!

Re: NVIDIA frenemy relation with OpenAI and Oracle

#86

Post by next_xibalba »

tims33 wrote: post #79

The specifics of the article zero sense. Net Income and Operating Cash Flow are not the same thing so there is no mystery about whey they are different especially in a business with large Capex and long lead times. NVIDIA's historic DSO figures have also ranged from 41 to 57 over the last 5 years, so again not that crazy.

> Net Income and Operating Cash Flow are not the same thing

This is the second article that gained a lot of traction on HN in the last few months with similar fundamental errors. The previous one was similarly written by someone with a dev background where they didn't understand the difference between gross margins, operating profit, and net income–concepts which were the basis for their analysis.

I wonder with this author or the previous, if they're just a little too confident in their abilities. Accounting and Finance are very deep and highly technical fields. Particularly for publicly traded companies where the businesses tend to be very complex and sophisticated and the consequences for making mistakes or committing fraud are severe. I'm not suggesting that non-finance people shouldn't try to analyze this stuff, but some humility might be in order.

It reminds me of a data scientist I worked with who was doing some modeling on companies' revenues. He believed he'd uncovered some secret, conspiratorial truth about Samsung having trillions in revenues, thereby making it the largest and most powerful entity on Earth. We had to gently inform him that he was looking at the revenues denominated in Korean Won and they needed to be converted to USD.

Re: NVIDIA frenemy relation with OpenAI and Oracle

#87

Post by shwaj »

cyanydeez wrote: post #52
mvkel wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that stocks are often valued and traded on revenue growth, not profit[0] So circular funding generates stock price bumps when, as you said, there's no inherent value underneath. Creates a recipe for a crash. [0] consider pagerduty, incredibly profitable with little revenue growth. Trading at 1.5X revenue, where high revenue growth, unprofitable companies are trading at 10X revenue.

Its crypto wash trading.

Why? Wash trading is about selling and then requiring the same asset for tax purposes. How is this analogous, other than that you presumably dislike both practices?

Re: NVIDIA frenemy relation with OpenAI and Oracle

#88

Post by kfarr »

0xbadcafebee wrote: post #66
throw234678 wrote: post #20

This post is written with its intellectual fly open. I'm not sure whether it was partly AI-generated, or whether the author has spent so much time ingesting AI-generated content that the tells have rubbed off, but this article has: - Strange paragraph-lists with bolded first words. e.g. "The Cash Flow Mystery" - The 'It's not just X; it's Y' meme: "Buying Groq wouldn't just [...], it could give them a chip that is ac…

Is this the new form of ad-hominem? ad-AI?

ai-hominem

Re: NVIDIA frenemy relation with OpenAI and Oracle

#89

Post by mr_toad »

wmf wrote: post #65

Since SRAM is typically built in logic fabs (like TSMC) alongside the processors themselves, it theoretically shouldn't face the same supply chain crunch as HBM. DRAM and logic fabs are both sold out so replacing one with the other doesn't really help. And SRAM uses ~6x more silicon area than DRAM. Groq may be undervalued but not for supply chain reasons.

> Groq may be undervalued but not for supply chain reasons.

Groq isn’t listed is it? Hard to know what its valuation might look like.

Re: NVIDIA frenemy relation with OpenAI and Oracle

#90

Post by nelox »

hogepiyo wrote: post #51
nelox wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

not an attempt to pass off anything as my own

then stop wasting peoples time with slop if i wanted to read llm output i'd go dump it into chatgpt into myself

Do I need to explain the meaning of not?
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