Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Germany votes to bring in voluntary military service programme for 18-year-olds

bbc.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

391–400 of 465 posts

Re: Germany votes to bring in voluntary military service programme for 18-year-olds

#391

Post by luckys »

sunshine-o wrote: post #69

This got to be the final scream of a dying regime. Not so long ago we were told a serious army has now to be a professional and highly trained army. Everything else was useless. But they seem to plan to just draft young people and fight some sort WWI a bit like the nightmare in Ukraine. But today Western Europe countries are not Ukraine. If they would engage in a war they would collapse into total chaos very quickly.…

The speedy success of Germany invading France in 1940 had more to do with their use of radios and giving commanders on the field some latitude on how to accomplish objectives than with the consequences of the Versailles treaty on the population. The French Army and the British Expeditionary Force were more stuck in a WWI style of command from the top that proved vulnerable to speed. But it wasn't clear cut as the "fast attack" plan was initially rejected by the German top brass, themselves still stuck in the past.

Re: Germany votes to bring in voluntary military service programme for 18-year-olds

#392

Post by jijijijij »

dzhiurgis wrote: post #358
jijijijij wrote: post #331

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Source for this? https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternative_f%C3%BCr_Deutschla... https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petr_Bystron There is plenty of news coverage. > Is Merkle part of AfD since she shat on Poland and Baltics 2 months ago? You mean Merkel? No, she is not part of the AfD. She also isn't part of the government anymore and her political influence since 2021, in particular 2 months ago, is basically zero. Did…

Latest source says probed and accused, but haven’t been proven. Not that I wanna defend them or Russia, but they do operate psyops on both sides. Of course she couldn’t say what she means while she was in politics, that would be suicidal. Merkel kept buying Russian gas for decades, German money indirectly responsible for killing thousands if not millions of Ukrainians… And then there’s Shroder literally working for G…

I mean, the process is on-going, but it's not like those are isolated incidences. The wikipedia article has quite a collection of facts which are extremely sus, especially in concert. Like systematically using their parliamentary rights to "liberate" oddly specific defense information.

Listen, I don't want to defend Merkel or Schröder. They both did a lot of damage to Germany. But I do believe, they genuinely thought Russia could be checked by economic integration. This was evidently false in hindsight. Merkel's politics is characterized by inaction and aversion, so not going into conflict with Russia absolutely tracks. Gas dependency and collapsing bridges have this in common.

Did you know Merkel is fluent in Russian and Putin is fluent in German? They never spoke the same language in any meeting. Then there was the dog incident. Merkel for sure was no friend of Putin, and certainly did not entertain any late soviet imperial fever dreams.

Re: Germany votes to bring in voluntary military service programme for 18-year-olds

#393

Post by jijijijij »

Amezarak wrote: post #357
jijijijij wrote: post #354

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> According the the US census data, median income in the US is 81k. That's household income. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_income_in_the_United_...

Yes, that was sloppy of me. The Census website doesn’t display well on mobile, but I should have recognize the number was too high. Nevertheless, the article you’re citing still cites American personal income as pretty close to German median income. Subtract taxes and/or adjust for PPP and…

> Nevertheless, the article you’re citing still cites American personal income as pretty close to German median income.

Do you realize how insane this statement is considering the wealth and economic power of America? And as cited above, cost of living is higher, quality of life is lower in the US too. Also why isn't the market correcting itself, hm? You had market deregulation under Clinton, super successful, wasn't it? And where is the money for higher wages coming from?

Listen my point is, before lecturing others on paying people more, mindlessly replaying red scare ideological brainwashing scripts, maybe fix your own damn economy, pay your own people right. You evidently know very little about life in Germany, maybe you should consider possible details and nuances you miss for a strong opinion.

Re: Germany votes to bring in voluntary military service programme for 18-year-olds

#394

Post by coolThingsFirst »

mystraline wrote: post #10

The article is using "voluntary" in a very questionable fashion. > Germany's parliament, the Bundestag, has voted to introduce voluntary military service... > The form will be mandatory for men and voluntary for women. > The government says military service will be voluntary for as long as possible, but from July 2027, all 18-year-old men will have to take a medical exam to assess their fitness for possible military…

We just pretended the genders were equal in a time of plenty now time to face the reality.

Re: Germany votes to bring in voluntary military service programme for 18-year-olds

#395

Post by flohofwoe »

frmersdog wrote: post #81
hopelite wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Wars are won on resolve, and mercenaries don't have any. The reason so many of these people fled to Europe in the first place was to avoid getting caught up in violence. They have zero reason to fight anything except the insistence that they fight. Also, this is racist as hell, why isn't it flagged to death yet?

> Wars are won on resolve

That's what Hitler thought too...

From what I learned as typical 'armchair general', wars are usually won by superior logistics.

Re: Germany votes to bring in voluntary military service programme for 18-year-olds

#396

Post by nephihaha »

thomassmith65 wrote: post #389
nephihaha wrote: post #387

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not just technically true, but the reality for vast areas such as the Ukraine and Kazakhstan etc which existed even then. There were numerous cities such as Vilnius or Dushanbe where most of the population did not speak Russian as a first or even native language or consider themselves Russian. It's like when people watch/read "Hunt for Red October" and call Captain Ramius a Russian... He isn't one, and it's a pretty…

I don't know what to tell you. We used 'Russians' and Soviets interchangeably during the Cold War, even if it was technically inaccurate. I'm not sure if anyone remembers the song 'Russians' by Sting anymore, but that's a good example. This is like someone correcting me for saying 'an LP' instead of 'a vinyl' despite my being an analog native :)

I'm sure you did. We did too. Some people still refer to Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland as "England"... Or all of the Netherlands as "Holland".

Re: Germany votes to bring in voluntary military service programme for 18-year-olds

#397

Post by coolThingsFirst »

The comments are so naive, in which world do you think Russia would beat Germany on german soil?

Russians are locked in Ukraine and are barely making progress. Also with which army is this takeover of Europe supposed to happen with? Russia lost millions of its young men in Ukraine. Fake fears, being prepared is always nice but the paranoia is ridiculous. Even a US China coaliation couldn't threaten Europe domestically let alone Russia.

Re: Germany votes to bring in voluntary military service programme for 18-year-olds

#398

Post by egorfine »

coolThingsFirst wrote: post #397

The comments are so naive, in which world do you think Russia would beat Germany on german soil? Russians are locked in Ukraine and are barely making progress. Also with which army is this takeover of Europe supposed to happen with? Russia lost millions of its young men in Ukraine. Fake fears, being prepared is always nice but the paranoia is ridiculous. Even a US China coaliation couldn't threaten Europe domesticall…

As a Ukrainian I see this take as both perfectly logical and utterly naive at the same time.

Re: Germany votes to bring in voluntary military service programme for 18-year-olds

#399

Post by egorfine »

cedws wrote: post #283
euroderf wrote: post #107

Leon Trotsky: "You may not be interested in war, but war is interested in you."

Send the older generations then. Why should Gen Z be forced to pay the price of the previous governments' poor decision making? Namely, in Germany, nurturing a authoritarian regime by decimating green energy initiatives in favor of Russian oil imports. Russia would never have taken such bold action if Europe responded strongly no later than 2014.

> Send the older generations then. Why should Gen Z be forced to pay the price

Yeah this is perfectly rational and logical. Hard to argue.

Problem is, the other side (russia) will not be sending just the older generation.

Re: Germany votes to bring in voluntary military service programme for 18-year-olds

#400

Post by nickdothutton »

consumer451 wrote: post #262
IAmGraydon wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have a source for NATO ending, I’m sure?

Trump being re-elected was the death knell, let's be honest. We are on our own here now. The next few years will make or break us. Our only hope is European Federalization, at the very least militarily. I believe we can do it. We must. We have no other choice. As far as evidence, "generally waves hands around." See the Trump/Putin surrender proposal. Also, see: https://www.france24.com/en/video/20251206-us-threatens-…

I don't want to be dismissive or trite, but good luck to any official who thinks the defence needs of (say) Portugal, align with the defence needs of (say) Poland. Could say the same along the N-S axis as on the E-W axis.
Post reply on HN