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Living in a Van

blog.priceonomics.com

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Re: Living in a Van

#51

Post by larrys »

tptacek wrote: post #36
patio11 wrote: post #15

This seems like a romantically bohemian way to approximate a pampered middle class kid's idea of how poor people live. If you want to save money, you can try what they actually do, which is move to a less desirable neighborhood and spend one third what you do on rent for an apartment. You live in a crazy expensive neck of the woods? Nice to meet you; I live in Japan, cry me a river. There's old folks on social securi…

It is interesting also to note that the ability to lead any kind of normal or predictable life in this fashion is itself a privilege. People in the software business can get away with wearing the same clothes, coming in wrinkled, missing the occasional shower, and, for that matter, getting in a little later after having to move the van in the middle of the night. Our field is extremely accommodating. Put yourself in…

"Glib is the word I would use, for romanticizing a scenario"

I would use glib in the same way that people romanticize people living in poverty. Particularly single moms with good kids living in the ghetto. Single mom works so hard holding down 3 jobs cleaning offices and her kids all work hard if only they were given a chance and didn't live in the projects. (Watch http://www.pruitt-igoe.com/ on netflix to see a little back story)

While that situation exists of course (and in fact I remember growing up commercials for the united negro college fund)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfwpeHzc8ks

...most likely in reality (drive through any poor neighborhood) there is something else going on that produces the behavior that is observed.

Re: Living in a Van

#52

Post by timmaah »

rohin wrote: post #38

Author here. In the article I link to a 60 Minutes segment that follows around families in Florida that turn to living in their cars as a last resort. Worth checking out as it offers a very different perspective on the experience: http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=7389750n

Your article is a good one, but the tone towards RV's and living in campgrounds is oddly negative.

>>An RV is basically a house on wheels and isn’t particularly inexpensive or minimalist.

Our was pretty inexpensive, is more minimalist than most US based folks and will hold its value just like the camper vans you mention.

>>If you pay to stay at a campsite, it’s most certainly legal, but then this lifestyle ceases to be inexpensive.

$25-$30 a night is most certainly cheaper than most mortgages or apartments.

Re: Living in a Van

#54

Post by pilom »

vijayr wrote: post #32
gavanwoolery wrote: post #14

Not quite a van or RV, but I have always found the tiny house movement interesting. http://www.tumbleweedhouses.com/ Many of them are small enough that you can legally tow them anywhere.

Wowwwww !! These look absolutely beautiful. But one still needs to own a piece of land. What would be interesting though, is a bunch of people buying a piece of land (sharing the land/electricity/water costs), and living in half a dozen of these on the land. Don't know about the legality of it, but it would be awesome

I think what you're recommending is called a trailer park. A trailer park with a very strict community guidelines.

Re: Living in a Van

#55

Post by Cass »

GFischer wrote: post #45
rdl wrote: post #8

My favorite "living in a van" story is http://www.hobostripper.com/ (I wonder how much worse a van is than a military trailer. Those range from 40x12 with private bathroom and nice furnishings down to 10x8 with a roommate and no bathroom. It's probably a lot easier due to everyone else around you doing exactly the same thing, and there being portapotties, shower trailers, etc. freely available.) I lived in a car for…

Would that scale for someone who wanted to do an extended visit to the Bay Area? (say a month or so) I'd like to visit San Francisco, but, apart from the US Visa and airfare, accomodation doesn't seem cheap (I haven't researched much but it comes up all the time here on HN). Food, oddly enough, sounds cheaper than in my 3rd world country.

Have you researched hostels? They're still not cheap by the standards of developing countries, but when I stayed in SF a few years ago, a bed at a hostel could be had for a fifth of what a hotel would have cost me, and certainly beats sleeping in a car. On the other hand, I found food shockingly expensive, and I come from Germany.

Re: Living in a Van

#56

Post by grecy »

I spent two years driving from Alaska to Argentina, feelancing website design and code along the way.

For the entire trip, my monthly expenses were less than they were in the 2 years prior just going to work every day. Yes, that includes gas for 40,000mi. I lived in my Jeep/tent the entire way.

I plan on doing something similar (but bigger) again, and I'll be building a more livable vehicle with a sink, stove, fridge, better sleeping, etc. etc.

http://theroadchoseme.com/the-price-of-adventure

Re: Living in a Van

#57

Post by pemulis »

larrys wrote: post #33
patio11 wrote: post #15

This seems like a romantically bohemian way to approximate a pampered middle class kid's idea of how poor people live. If you want to save money, you can try what they actually do, which is move to a less desirable neighborhood and spend one third what you do on rent for an apartment. You live in a crazy expensive neck of the woods? Nice to meet you; I live in Japan, cry me a river. There's old folks on social securi…

"is class disdain because I'm too well off to consider it or class disdain because when I wasn't well off we had too much pride to ever stoop to anything like that." Normally when you read stories about these outliers in life there is always a story behind it. I remember the case of the guy on the street corner who was discovered as having singing talent, made it to network news shows, was given some sort of leg up o…

So we have someone who didn't play his guitar because it was in another room. And someone who spent 3 hours per day watching a sitcom on netflix. And you wonder why he is living in a van?

Watching Netflix for a few hours in a row and having an instrument you don't play as much as you should are incredibly common experiences. I don't know how you extrapolate that into some sort of mental illness or moral failure that leads to living in a van. I don't think he was literally too lazy to go to another room to play his guitar. It's just a way of saying that when you have a big house and a lot of stuff you can lose track of things you used to find important and fulfilling.

Re: Living in a Van

#58

Post by tgrass »

tptacek wrote: post #36
patio11 wrote: post #15

This seems like a romantically bohemian way to approximate a pampered middle class kid's idea of how poor people live. If you want to save money, you can try what they actually do, which is move to a less desirable neighborhood and spend one third what you do on rent for an apartment. You live in a crazy expensive neck of the woods? Nice to meet you; I live in Japan, cry me a river. There's old folks on social securi…

It is interesting also to note that the ability to lead any kind of normal or predictable life in this fashion is itself a privilege. People in the software business can get away with wearing the same clothes, coming in wrinkled, missing the occasional shower, and, for that matter, getting in a little later after having to move the van in the middle of the night. Our field is extremely accommodating. Put yourself in…

Good to know we shouldn't have pleasure so long as there is any man who can't share in it.

[EDIT] single father/middle class technocrat here, living paycheck to paycheck. Many of my friends make less than I do. By this measure of hubris, I should not go out to eat so long as fellow engineers are looking for work.

Re: Living in a Van

#59

Post by Cass »

Osiris wrote: post #35
markerdmann wrote: post #11

This reminds of a good friend. He got a job making six figures at Google straight out of college, and then lived in his van--in the Google parking lot--while saving every penny he earned. He took showers on campus and only ate free Google food. After a few years, he went into a mini-retirement and devoted his time to traveling around the world and volunteering.

I would have loved to save money right out of school, being as frugal as I am, but I was married when I graduated and the first thing my wife wanted after I got my first (low paying) full time job? A house. So much for the life of a cheapskate.

Putting money into a house you'll presumably be able to live in rent-free once it's paid off may not be a drastically worse choice than putting your money into savings. Unless it was an impractically huge house, or otherwise somehow not a keeper, I wouldn't consider that a frivolous/non-frugal purchase.

Re: Living in a Van

#60

Post by prodigal_erik »

timmaah wrote: post #52
rohin wrote: post #38

Author here. In the article I link to a 60 Minutes segment that follows around families in Florida that turn to living in their cars as a last resort. Worth checking out as it offers a very different perspective on the experience: http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=7389750n

Your article is a good one, but the tone towards RV's and living in campgrounds is oddly negative. >>An RV is basically a house on wheels and isn’t particularly inexpensive or minimalist. Our was pretty inexpensive, is more minimalist than most US based folks and will hold its value just like the camper vans you mention. >>If you pay to stay at a campsite, it’s most certainly legal, but then this lifestyle ceases to…

I wouldn't say "most". $800/month may not go very far in SF or NY, but it's about what I was paying for a large two-bedroom apartment in Seattle, and flyover country is cheaper still.
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