what is phev?
Plug-in Hybrid Electric Vehicle. It's the most complex drivetrain you can possibly buy with a full gas engine and transmission mated to a full EV with external charging support.
BMW PHEV: Safety fuse replacement is extremely expensive
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Re: BMW PHEV: Safety fuse replacement is extremely expensive
#142Earlier quoted context omitted.
EVs are not complicated. Modern carmakers might make them complicated, and you're well within your right to avoid those, but in general electronic propulsion is pretty simple. The problem is car manufacturing is a very expensive industry that's extremely difficult to disrupt, so incumbents aren't really worried about staying ahead of hungry competitors. Go look at small-scale PEVs - ebikes, scooters, unicycles, etc.…
> EVs are not complicated. > Modern carmakers might make them complicated OP did not say they would not travel on electric trains or unicycles or elevators or electric forklifts or electric container ships. They said they don't want an EV. The things that modern carmakers make complicated.
> They said they don't want an EV. The things that modern carmakers make complicated.
It's probably more of a sign of what's coming in the future. There is no need to make EVs difficult/expensive to repair. The change in technology is just an excuse to lock everything down and rake in more money for repairs/new vehicles. They could do the same for ICE vehicles too.
Re: BMW PHEV: Safety fuse replacement is extremely expensive
#143This is what makes Teslas sustainable and other car cos, like Porsche, not. A battery pack for a Model 3 is $10K. So even if the whole car is only worth $20K, it's still worth keeping on the road. The Porsche Taycan battery pack is $70K. The moment you have any issue at all with it, the car will be considered totaled.
Is that $10k the list price, or have you actually seen a recent invoice from a mechanic for a Model 3 battery swap?
It’s an urban legend.
Re: BMW PHEV: Safety fuse replacement is extremely expensive
#144what is phev?
Plug in hybrid.
Re: BMW PHEV: Safety fuse replacement is extremely expensive
#145Earlier quoted context omitted.
It is a BMW problem and the rest is clickbait. If you own a BMW you know all this as it has been the case for over decades. It's also not a eu thing as all manufacturers are locking things up, Ford and other US brands are trying as much as all other manufacturers. They just haven't reached BMW levels yet.
UN Regulation No. 155, and 156, and the Cyber Resilience Act (CRA) are requiring car manufacturers to implement cryptographic validation that allows only authorized software from the manufacturer to be run.
What I meant more is that you need more and more specialized tools (according to the manufacturers). My previous ford needed a special (expensive!) bracket to keep the drivetrain in place if you want to do anything on the engine which makes home service less likely.
These regulations do not mean you need 25k in tooling, but that is what it has come to. And thus there is a blooming (mostly Chinese/Russian) aftermarket tooling business with sketchy software you want to run in a VM.
Re: BMW PHEV: Safety fuse replacement is extremely expensive
#146This is what makes Teslas sustainable and other car cos, like Porsche, not. A battery pack for a Model 3 is $10K. So even if the whole car is only worth $20K, it's still worth keeping on the road. The Porsche Taycan battery pack is $70K. The moment you have any issue at all with it, the car will be considered totaled.
> The moment you have any issue at all with it, the car will be considered totaled.
Huh? The taycan has an 8-year/100k mile battery warranty. How many 100k+ mile carreras do you see for sale on eBay?
Re: BMW PHEV: Safety fuse replacement is extremely expensive
#147replacing a tesla pyro fuse is about $500, and it has a lifetime.
I think it might be the ev equivalent of a wear item like a water pump or alternator on an ice vehicle.
Re: BMW PHEV: Safety fuse replacement is extremely expensive
#148Earlier quoted context omitted.
It is a BMW problem and the rest is clickbait. If you own a BMW you know all this as it has been the case for over decades. It's also not a eu thing as all manufacturers are locking things up, Ford and other US brands are trying as much as all other manufacturers. They just haven't reached BMW levels yet.
Lol no way do BMW owners commonly know this. Most buy the car because it says BMW on it and they think that means quality.
I was more or less pointing to the expensive repairs needed in BMW as in you know it's locked down and you need expensive OEM stuff. Maybe that is covered under "quality is expensive" for normal people but when you buy a BMW you know the replacement parts bill is costing you an arm and a leg.
Re: BMW PHEV: Safety fuse replacement is extremely expensive
#149€4000 euros plus tax to replace the module that contains the fuse. Insane. The ford transit custom PHEV costs £4500 to replace the timing belt. Access issues mean dropping the hybrid battery and parts of the sub frame. Compare with the mk8 transit, i've done the wet belt myself on that and it requires no special tools (well, i bought a specific crank pulley puller for £20) and can be done in a day on the driveway. I…
> So far my favourite brand to work on has been Mazda, the engineering is very thoughtfully done with consideration for repairs
I've heard this from mechanics already 15+ years ago. Mazda seem to still have this reputation.
I wish there were more repairability scores for cars.
Re: BMW PHEV: Safety fuse replacement is extremely expensive
#150This is exactly why I’m so uninterested in driving en EV. I usually word it as “I don’t want to drive a computer”, but the reality is that I don’t want to be on the wrong end of the power imbalance that comes from this amount of complexity.
The complexity here is partially a consequence of the energy storage mechanism and may be essential.
It is not possible for an entire tank of gasoline to spontaneously detonate in the same way that an EV battery can. If a mechanic fucks up a procedure and drills a hole through fuel tank, it's not fantastic but you can usually detect and recover from this before it gets to be catastrophic. If you accidentally puncture an EV battery or drop something across the terminals it can instantly kill everyone working on the car. These are not the same kind of risk profile.
I would not want work on anything with a high voltage system. Especially if it had been involved in an accident or was poorly maintained. These fuses and interlocks can only help up to a certain point. Energy is energy and it's in there somewhere. You can have 40kW for an entire hour or 100MW for 2 seconds. Gasoline cars usually throw a rod or something before getting much beyond 2x their rated power output.