Do You Really Want to be Doing this When You're 50? • Hacker News Board

Re: Do You Really Want to be Doing this When You're 50?

#141

Post by stevewilhelm » Thu, Oct 04, 2012, 3:09 PM UTC

mengine wrote: post #132

jerf wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're presuming an awful lot in that analysis there. Besides, who is not a cog in some wheel or other? In civilized countries, there is nobody who is at the top of all hierarchies, no King. It's a pejorative with no bite if it applies to all.

I just find it sad people write themselves off as never being rich or running their own business. There are 16 year olds making 6 figures writing their own iphone apps yet people view their only alternative to programming is moving to middle management.

"16 year olds making 6 figures writing their own iphone apps "

The reality is there are very few people making six figures writing their own iphone apps. Even fewer that can sustain that level of income as a sole proprietorship for a couple of decades, which is what you will need to do to retire at fifty.

For every programmer who does create a sustainable business, fewer still get rich doing so. One reason, creating a wildly successful business is a completely different skill set from programming. Another reason, it takes a fair amount of luck for a company to become wildly successful.

Goog luck.

Re: Do You Really Want to be Doing this When You're 50?

#142

Post by Wintamute » Thu, Oct 04, 2012, 3:13 PM UTC

gliese1337 wrote: post #131

edw519 wrote: post #60

57, programming for 33 years with hardly a day off, and having more fun than ever. My motivation? It's not about the technology, the tools, the apps, the business, the customers, or even the money, although any of those can provide plenty of motivation. And believe it or not, it's not even about the happy dance feeling I get when something I built works for the first time. It's about the achievements of those who use…

23, programming for, what, 14 years, maybe? And I hope I still have as much fun when I'm 57. I can certainly imagine myself doing so, for much the same reasons; it is partially about the happy dance feeling when something I built works, but long-term happiness and satisfaction come from seeing it getting used. It's really, really cool to see someone's masters thesis and think "I helped make that!" or drive by an elem…

I think it makes more sense to start measuring from the time you started professionally programming ... so if the 57 year old parent has been programming for 33 years that suggests that he's measuring from when he left full time education (24). My apologies if you've been coding professionally since you were 9 though :)

Re: Do You Really Want to be Doing this When You're 50?

#143

Post by ef4 » Thu, Oct 04, 2012, 3:22 PM UTC

No matter what you do, you should absolutely be asking yourself "do I want to still be doing this in N years?".

It isn't just a matter of trying to have a fulfilling life -- it's a matter of survival. People who don't look up once in a while and consider their larger place are the people who get steamrolled when a new technology kills their entire industry.

Re: Do You Really Want to be Doing this When You're 50?

#144

Post by mturmon » Thu, Oct 04, 2012, 3:26 PM UTC

mengine wrote: post #116

edw519 wrote: post #60

57, programming for 33 years with hardly a day off, and having more fun than ever. My motivation? It's not about the technology, the tools, the apps, the business, the customers, or even the money, although any of those can provide plenty of motivation. And believe it or not, it's not even about the happy dance feeling I get when something I built works for the first time. It's about the achievements of those who use…

This sounds pretty depressing to me. You're building the software that allows others to retire while you're a cog in someone else's wheel for another 33 years. Why not build your own achievements?

Is your main goal to retire?

If you want to build big things, in most cases you can't work alone. In a big team, everyone plays a part. Call them a "cog" if you want.

And, sometimes the specialization that happens in big teams allows people (err...cogs) to really push the state of the art by engaging one hard problem for a long time.

Re: Do You Really Want to be Doing this When You're 50?

#145

Post by Evbn » Thu, Oct 04, 2012, 3:32 PM UTC

stevewilhelm wrote: post #141

mengine wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just find it sad people write themselves off as never being rich or running their own business. There are 16 year olds making 6 figures writing their own iphone apps yet people view their only alternative to programming is moving to middle management.

"16 year olds making 6 figures writing their own iphone apps " The reality is there are very few people making six figures writing their own iphone apps. Even fewer that can sustain that level of income as a sole proprietorship for a couple of decades, which is what you will need to do to retire at fifty. For every programmer who does create a sustainable business, fewer still get rich doing so. One reason, creating…

"goog luck"

Great Fredudian typo, or greatest Freudian typo?

Re: Do You Really Want to be Doing this When You're 50?

#146

Post by happywolf » Thu, Oct 04, 2012, 3:33 PM UTC

I have been programming for 10+ years professionally (not counting those 'Hello world' days in school), and I need to admit the OP hit the nail at its head. Yes, I still believe programming is fun, problem solving is fun, and solving a hardcore problem is fun. But putting all these in the context of a tight deadline, management who has no clue about technology, and changing requirements, I really am tired to pull the miracle off by working my ass off.

A quick glance through the posts here reviews a lot of folks here have better luck and it is a good thing. To put things in perspective, I have been working in Asia Pac and now in China. Now I am in the business dev turf where a technical background is proven useful.

Re: Do You Really Want to be Doing this When You're 50?

#147

Post by Evbn » Thu, Oct 04, 2012, 3:33 PM UTC

mengine wrote: post #132

jerf wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're presuming an awful lot in that analysis there. Besides, who is not a cog in some wheel or other? In civilized countries, there is nobody who is at the top of all hierarchies, no King. It's a pejorative with no bite if it applies to all.

I just find it sad people write themselves off as never being rich or running their own business. There are 16 year olds making 6 figures writing their own iphone apps yet people view their only alternative to programming is moving to middle management.

It's OK, one day you will get over your insecurities and inferiority complexes, and not fear people who are capable and comfortable of working on a team.

Re: Do You Really Want to be Doing this When You're 50?

#148

Post by agentultra » Thu, Oct 04, 2012, 3:35 PM UTC

Yes and I hope to continue programming well into my 60s and beyond if I will be so lucky.

However I hope that by then I won't be working for a boss and stressing to meet deadlines. I hope that I will be conducting research and working with fellow hackers to seek out the next frontier of the future.

While I think the present we live in now is full of wonders, I don't get a very gratifying sense that it's going to last. It seems more to me that we're finally able to apply the things we've spent enormous amounts of time and money learning over the last thirty years -- we're not out seeking the future so much as we're claiming a stake in the present.

Re: Do You Really Want to be Doing this When You're 50?

#149

Post by Evbn » Thu, Oct 04, 2012, 3:38 PM UTC

michaelochurch wrote: post #77

I enjoy programming and would like to be doing it at 50, but with regard to the software industry itself... not in its current state. If you want to be able to survive more than 10 years in the software industry, you need to get manager-level clout and full autonomy over your work. That's non-negotiable. This industry destroys you if you don't have those things. The terrifying thing about the software industry is tha…

High-powered service-oriented software companies like Google and Amazon are great for this, where every engineer runs their own project and has vendor-client relationships with other engineers, where the vendor bills are paid by management based on client satisfaction.

Re: Do You Really Want to be Doing this When You're 50?

#150

Post by epo » Thu, Oct 04, 2012, 3:39 PM UTC

People are being very selective in what they are responding to. The final words are "But large scale, high stress coding? I may have to admit that's a young man's game." High stress coding is what companies can get away with when they hire kids fresh out of college, i.e. young, stupid and inexperienced.

And before people throw a hissy fit about being called 'stupid', look back at 10 years ago and tell me you weren't stupid with regard to what you think is important now.

No one is saying you can't (or shouldn't) code in your 50s or beyond, but the older you get the more particular you get about what you work on and what your working conditions are.