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India orders smartphone makers to preload state-owned cyber safety app

reuters.com

211–220 of 783 posts

Re: India orders smartphone makers to preload state-owned cyber safety app

#211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's sadly how the culture is in India. I wish it improved to be more like Japan or China but I'm not sure how one can solve this sort of issue.

Require all people who received higher education to work for their country first for 15 to 20 years. There's no point in being able to buy an outrageously fancy toilet with remittances if there's no sewer to hook it up to.

That would be a great way to make the brain drain even worse.

Re: India orders smartphone makers to preload state-owned cyber safety app

#212
post #120

I'm shocked by people and state using the crutch of cyber crime or scams to push a totalitarian solution to a problem that is better solved by improved education and targeted campaigns against common security pitfalls. I abhor any decision that robs even a grain of my individual freedom.

FYI two years ago, the Indian government shut down mobile service in the state of Punjab to catch one person: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35303486

I don't buy their reasoning.

With all the mobile tracking tech, I would have thought that it would have been easier to catch the person if they had a working phone on them.

Re: India orders smartphone makers to preload state-owned cyber safety app

#213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This seems to be the app: https://www.sancharsaathi.gov.in/ Looks like it's quire popular/established already, with over 10 million downloads. Basically a "portal" for basic digital safety/hygiene related services. Quoting Perplexity regarding what facilities the app offers: 1. Chakshu: Report suspicious calls, SMS, or WhatsApp for scams like impersonation, fake investments, or KYC frauds. 2. Block Lost/Stolen Phones…

How does an app inspect other app's storage data (like whatsapp). I thought Android security model blocked that. Does it have root access?

It probably just asks you to enter the associated WhatsApp number

Re: India orders smartphone makers to preload state-owned cyber safety app

#214
post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mate, this isn't even remotely "nationalist". This stuff is being pushed across the world. Digital ID? The only people really desperate for it are our rulers.

The lack of digital ID is a huge problem in many domains and enables a lot of scams and crime in the first place. Requiring identification in situations that don't need it is where the problems start, but that's possible with analog IDs as well, and is often even worse there (since these provide neither security against digital copies, nor privacy, which digital ID can, e.g. via zero knowledge proofs).

Personally, I liked the low-tech solution of code cards + password (2FA), used by e.g. Denmark as digital ID, now discontinued. I am aware that it is imperfect, and if you are not careful with MITM attacks you can get in trouble, but it was a good compromise to avoid the temptation to track citizens. Something like a hardware TAN generator, but with protection against MITM, would be an ideal compromise. The current trend of moving towards mobile apps that require hardware attestation is worrying.

Re: India orders smartphone makers to preload state-owned cyber safety app

#215

Sounds so authoritarian. Luckily, in the UK you only have to scan your face and ID to access cat photos.

It's all happening really quickly, so I haven't been able to keep up. I know Starmer said that digital ID will be mandatory to work in the UK. Did he mention how that would be implemented? Is the UK going to issue and official device to everyone in country, or are the people supposed to pay for it? What about homeless, poor, and the provisional residents?

Re: India orders smartphone makers to preload state-owned cyber safety app

#216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All good goals - but this can be done by the government forcing the private companies (Apple/Goog/Samsung) to build tools, reporting, support services around helping with both Scamming applications or Stolen phones etc.... This will keep the data out of governments hands, while pushing the cost burden to these companies and they would be better equipped to build around these goals than the government themselves. We a…

I don't think the Indian government realistically has the ability to enforce on Apple/Google/Samsung like that. Regardless, even if they did, India has a diversity of (what we would probably consider) garbage smartphones. For anyone who lives in the West and is used to the kind of state legibility and control here, I think they'd find India quite surprising. The state has limited visibility and control there, simply…

I feel like you are making a contradicting point, on one hand you say its all disorganized but "organized enough" to allow the govt to force install their app, but not enough so it can coordinate the same thing with the same people they are going to force to install the app?

Re: India orders smartphone makers to preload state-owned cyber safety app

#217

I'm shocked by people and state using the crutch of cyber crime or scams to push a totalitarian solution to a problem that is better solved by improved education and targeted campaigns against common security pitfalls. I abhor any decision that robs even a grain of my individual freedom.

> I'm shocked India is currently run by a nationalist regime headed by the so called "butcher of Gujarat"[1], there isn't much that would shock me wrt to that lot's totalitarian tendencies. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_image_of_Narendra_Modi

Are you shocked by the EU similarly attacking the human rights of its own people?

Re: India orders smartphone makers to preload state-owned cyber safety app

#218
post #203

Does this mean visitors to India would also get this app installed on their phone as soon as they land in India?

Apple's geotargetting was at least in the past tied to where device was sold. Example is FaceTime in UAE: phones sold there will never have working FaceTime anywhere but if you bring your American phone in, it seems to work.

But easy enough to tie it to iCloud region - you have to set your device and iCloud to Indian region to be able to use many of their region specific payment methods (ie UPI)

Re: India orders smartphone makers to preload state-owned cyber safety app

#219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> improved education and targeted campaigns against common security pitfalls Good one. Do you see how dumb the average consumer is? They don't know or care even if you try to educate them.

I shouldn't have to accept government surveillance just because 15% of the population is functionally illiterate. We should have support structures for those people as a society, but "dumb people exist" is a fucking horrible argument for why I should have my freedom restricted

You shouldn't, I agree with you, but what's the solution that works for everyone, not just the tech literate?
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