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System 7 natively boots on the Mac mini G4

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Re: System 7 natively boots on the Mac mini G4

#101

Post by icedchai »

anthk wrote: post #92
deaddodo wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And yet, OS 8 and OS 9 couldn't even match that joke.

Ahem, w98 BSOD if you sneezed hard near it. Installing a driver? BSOD. IE page fault? BSOD. 128k stack limit reached? either grind to a halt or a BSOD. And so on...

I worked at a company that was delivering a client-side app in Java launched from IE. I think we had an ActiveX plugin as the "launcher." This predated "Java Web Start." It was hysterically bad. We were targeting 32 meg Win 98 systems and they were comically slow and unstable. Most of our developers had 64 and 128 meg boxes with NT 4.0. I mostly worked on the server side stuff, and used them as a terminal into the Solaris and Linux systems.

Re: System 7 natively boots on the Mac mini G4

#102

Post by icedchai »

ErroneousBosh wrote: post #46
swiftcoder wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Preemption is a very nice OS feature it turns out (particularly once multi-core rolled around). Still, I recall os 8 and 9 being generally snappier than windows 98 (and a lot snappier than early builds of OSX)

How does preemption work on a processor that barely has interrupts and has no way to recover state after a page fault, in an OS that has to fit into a couple dozen kilobytes of ROM?

Later Mac ROMs were 512KB, same with the later Amiga Kickstarts (3.x) That was a lot of space for the late 80's and early 90's. Interrupts were supported (8, if I recall.) And 68000 machines didn't support virtual memory until the 68010 and later, so no issues with page faults.

I still remember the day teenage me got an Amiga 500 with a whopping 512K of RAM, and witnessed the power of multitasking, way back in 1988.

Re: System 7 natively boots on the Mac mini G4

#103

Post by Mikhail_Edoshin »

StilesCrisis wrote: post #58
geerlingguy wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not only that, everything felt _snappy_. No wasteful animations to add 0.28 ms to every interaction.

System 6 had menu blinks, zoom animations (with rect XORs no less), and button blinks when you used keyboard completion. Mac was the original "wasteful animation" OS.

This is feedback. You press a shortcut; how do you know it worked or not? You do because the corresponding menu rapidly blinked. Or you double click an icon and suddenly a rectangle appears in another part of the screen. Is this related? Here the animation shows that yes, the icon transformed into a window.

On the other hand on my mobile Firefox I wait seemingly a half second each time I long press a link, because there is an animation that zooms a context menu. It does not zoom from the link, which could be justified maybe, but always in the same place in the center of the screen. This animation is meaningless and thus wasteful.

Re: System 7 natively boots on the Mac mini G4

#104

Post by deaddodo »

anthk wrote: post #92
deaddodo wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And yet, OS 8 and OS 9 couldn't even match that joke.

Ahem, w98 BSOD if you sneezed hard near it. Installing a driver? BSOD. IE page fault? BSOD. 128k stack limit reached? either grind to a halt or a BSOD. And so on...

> To be clear, Win98 was a garbage fire of an OS (when it came to stability); which makes it so much worse that Mac OS 8 and 9 were so bad.

Re: System 7 natively boots on the Mac mini G4

#105

Post by mietek »

lostlogin wrote: post #96
k310 wrote: post #11

> It is also my opinion Mac OS 9.2.2 is the greatest OS, and Mac OS, ever, but not everything that is possible in earlier Mac OS versions is possible in Mac OS 9.2.2. I had fun with hypercard on MacOS 9. At work, even. The boss was into rapid prototyping, and I cooked up some damn productive stacks in a hurry. It runs on the Cube and under OS 9 emulation on the new stuff. Hypercard scripters did cool things that most…

> Mac OS 9.2.2 is the greatest OS It still irritates me that command + N does a new window, not a new folder. I wouldn’t even have used that shortcut much, as I was a kid and it’s been 25 years.

1. Go to the App Shortcuts subsection of the Shortcuts section of the Keyboard preferences panel in System Preferences.

2. Add an arbitrary keyboard shortcut (perhaps ⌥⌘N) for the "New Finder Window" Finder menu command.

3. Add your desired keyboard shortcut (⌘N) for the "New Folder" Finder menu command.

4. Restart Finder.

Re: System 7 natively boots on the Mac mini G4

#106

Post by elliotnunn »

chongli wrote: post #70
elliotnunn wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Max frustrating. If I were writing tbxi again it would be in Go.

Why not C89? Try to make it as portable as possible. The software is intended for preservation of old computers and their software. Would make sense for the software to be as portable as possible. Who knows, maybe someone would want to run it on vintage Mac hardware?

This is a good point. For a while, I was writing vintage Mac hacking tools in ANSI C [1].

The answer is that it's too hard. I want to see the Happy Mac on as much exotic hardware as possible, but my day job keeps me very busy, and I want to enjoy my hobby without tedium and toil. I prefer to use a language that is "easier to write, easier to read, easier to understand, easier to maintain" [2].

[1] https://github.com/elliotnunn/mac-rom/blob/master/Tools/Tool... [2] https://commandcenter.blogspot.com/2012/06/less-is-exponenti...

Re: System 7 natively boots on the Mac mini G4

#107

Post by anthk »

deaddodo wrote: post #104
anthk wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ahem, w98 BSOD if you sneezed hard near it. Installing a driver? BSOD. IE page fault? BSOD. 128k stack limit reached? either grind to a halt or a BSOD. And so on...

> To be clear, Win98 was a garbage fire of an OS (when it came to stability); which makes it so much worse that Mac OS 8 and 9 were so bad .

WIn 98SE and Mac OS 9 were on par. Ditto with System 7.5.3 and Windows 95 OSR2.

Re: System 7 natively boots on the Mac mini G4

#108

Post by lostlogin »

mietek wrote: post #105
lostlogin wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Mac OS 9.2.2 is the greatest OS It still irritates me that command + N does a new window, not a new folder. I wouldn’t even have used that shortcut much, as I was a kid and it’s been 25 years.

1. Go to the App Shortcuts subsection of the Shortcuts section of the Keyboard preferences panel in System Preferences. 2. Add an arbitrary keyboard shortcut (perhaps ⌥⌘N) for the "New Finder Window" Finder menu command. 3. Add your desired keyboard shortcut (⌘N) for the "New Folder" Finder menu command. 4. Restart Finder.

Thank you!

Re: System 7 natively boots on the Mac mini G4

#109

Post by mietek »

spockz wrote: post #66
JKCalhoun wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, gotta be super snappy on a Mac mini G4! Yeah, when a coworker and I showed my wife the first OS X preview, she was alarmed at how long it took to shut down (I mean System 7 shut down like you just kicked the cord out). "You'll have to find something else to like about it," was my coworker's response. And to be sure, there was/is a lot to like about OS X. But, probably because of the lack of a kernel, etc., System…

There are plenty of ways to multi threaded code these days. From actors to coroutines on the programmatic interface level to using green threads directly in go or Java. There is very little reason to resort using locks, mutexes, or semaphores outside of frameworks designed to make multi threading easier or very specific high performance code. (Where in the latter case it could be argued that multi threaded probably a…

Whoever is downvoting you for speaking the truth should go stand in a corner. Or try maining BeOS for a while, to experience first-hand what happens when application programmers are forced to use threads and locks.

Re: System 7 natively boots on the Mac mini G4

#110

Post by mietek »

JKCalhoun wrote: post #49
geerlingguy wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not only that, everything felt _snappy_. No wasteful animations to add 0.28 ms to every interaction.

Oh, gotta be super snappy on a Mac mini G4! Yeah, when a coworker and I showed my wife the first OS X preview, she was alarmed at how long it took to shut down (I mean System 7 shut down like you just kicked the cord out). "You'll have to find something else to like about it," was my coworker's response. And to be sure, there was/is a lot to like about OS X. But, probably because of the lack of a kernel, etc., System…

Threads and locks are fundamentally the wrong abstraction for most scenarios. This is explained in complementary ways in two of the finest technical books ever written, Joe Armstrong's "Programming Erlang" and Simon Marlow's "Parallel and Concurrent Programming in Haskell". I highly recommend both.

Thank you for many fond memories of playing Glider and Pararena.

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