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Bird flu viruses are resistant to fever, making them a major threat to humans

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Re: Bird flu viruses are resistant to fever, making them a major threat to humans

#51

I'd imagine that in the event of a Bird Flu pandemic, a vaccine would be developed and dispatched quite quickly, unlike with COVID, where during the early days experts were saying it was possible we'd never get a vaccine.

But the current administration is antivax so…

Something I love to point out to Trump supporters is that he is the one who fast tracked the “clot shot”.

Re: Bird flu viruses are resistant to fever, making them a major threat to humans

#52
post #15

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This is simply not true. Bird flu mainly spreads among wild birds and that is where it has its reservoir. It would still exist even if the world was free of bird farms. It also usually doesn't spread between farms because, in the event of an outbreak, all the animals on the affected farm are culled. At most, bird farms slightly increase overall contact between birds and humans.

Re: Bird flu viruses are resistant to fever, making them a major threat to humans

#53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1. The idea that UPFs being poorly defined == UPF is a meaningless designation has always sounded like absurd whataboutism that stops real progress to me. Surely you don't mean to suggest that just because UPFs aren't perfectly defined, that means there's no fundamental difference between a diet composed of skittles, donuts, and ice cream cookie sandwiches versus a diet composed of organic, plant-based whole foods, r…

Bread is an ultra-processed food.

Care to engage more substantially than this, or are you just repeating the argument that because UPF is imperfectly defined, that means UPF as a category is absolutely worthless and therefore we should dismiss all precautionary options surrounding any and all UPFs with prejudice?

Re: Bird flu viruses are resistant to fever, making them a major threat to humans

#54
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not even cheap food, just cheap meat. We could still have plenty of cheap, salty, fatty food without the livestock.

Yeah. It's very cheap to grow large amounts of canola seed, soybeans, potatoes, corn, and wheat to make all manner of high-salt, high-fat, high-carb junk food.

Yeah bro, meat is the only non-junk food available.

Re: Bird flu viruses are resistant to fever, making them a major threat to humans

#55
post #16

There is a vaccine though. https://news.sky.com/story/uk-prepares-five-million-vaccine-...

That's a vaccine for one strain: H5N1. I'm sure birds have many more strains and variants of virus. I'm sure a proper virologist can dive in here ... I think people assume that a fever is caused by an infection but my understanding is that a fever is a response to the infection. The body raises its temperature deliberately to destroy a viral infection, even though it is unpleasant, as well as deploying the other defe…

Not a proper virologist, but H5N5 killed a person in Washington state recently.

There will likely be some cross protection on the H5 antigen, just as some regular flu shots provide cross protection against the N1 antigen of H5N1. (The H5 and N1 subtypes won't be completely matched, respectively, but you don't always need complete matching for some protection.)

Re: Bird flu viruses are resistant to fever, making them a major threat to humans

#56
post #15

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I am not sure how dangerous it is. Not saying it is not but maybe hyperbole.

I have been hearing this and the climate change stuff since I was young as a threat to humans and I think there must be a lot more than science in here, at least, in my humble opinion.

Re: Bird flu viruses are resistant to fever, making them a major threat to humans

#57

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Why we keep killing the birds that survive the infection is beyond me. It's an evolutionary pressure that we refuse to allow to work. It's almost as if we want to give the flu as many opportunities as possible to spill over, instead of just letting the birds who have immunity survive and thus basically drive the virus to extinction.

I believe the rationale is that during the process of infecting a flock of birds the virus would be exposed to pressure that would encourage its mutation, especially as these birds begin to successfully fight it off. The current avian H5N1 only needs a couple of mutations to spread human-to-human pretty well.

So the current culling of entire flocks is seen as a means of nipping any of these mutations in the bud.

Re: Bird flu viruses are resistant to fever, making them a major threat to humans

#58

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Even with a flawed messenger pointing the wrong tools at the wrong target, isn't "avoiding ultraprocessed foods, seed oils, pesticides, and fluoride" still fundamentally a step in the right direction, compared to previous politically-connected health campaigns, like the infamous one not so long ago to "get out and move", which placed blame on kids for being unable to out-exercise a bad diet, while doing absolutely no…

I may have seen it here, but there's a new article out on childhood fluoride exposure: https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/sciadv.adz0757

"Whereas most prior research has estimated effects of exposure to extremely high levels of fluoride, we consider exposure to levels of fluoride within the range typical in most places and of greatest relevance to policy debates about government water fluoridation. We use data from the nationally representative (United States) High School and Beyond cohort, characterize fluoride exposure from drinking water across adolescence, adjust for confounders, and observe cognitive test performance in both secondary school and at age ~60. We find that children exposed to recommended levels of fluoride in drinking water exhibit modestly better cognition in secondary school, an advantage that is smaller and no longer statistically significant at age ~60."

I'm very much overweight, though not morbidly obese. I have been at my best weight when I did "get out and move". The problem, of course, is that schools, jobs, and modern infrastructure don't make that as easy to do as in prior decades. You can't just tell people to do something that has been made difficult to do and expect them to do it.

Re: Bird flu viruses are resistant to fever, making them a major threat to humans

#59

I'd imagine that in the event of a Bird Flu pandemic, a vaccine would be developed and dispatched quite quickly, unlike with COVID, where during the early days experts were saying it was possible we'd never get a vaccine.

The US has antivaxxers in charge of health policy now, and they have specifically targeted mRNA vaccines with funding cuts. They seem likely to hinder rather than help any near future vaccines development program in response to a pandemic.

Re: Bird flu viruses are resistant to fever, making them a major threat to humans

#60
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which has been happening for centuries. I’m actually not arguing against this being a bad idea though lol, just giving some historic trivia.

We have not been factory farming for centuries. More like a century. And it hasn't been a century with a sterling track record! I think we can all recall an event in recent memory where having a lot of animals in close proximity and unhealthy conditions went super duper wrong. And we have problems with new strains of bird flu every couple of years.

I agree, I agree. I’m not a fan of the farming methods we have today mostly because of ethical reasons (hence why I’m vegetarian as well).

We are definitely making things worse, also by our use of antibiotics in livestock.

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