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Migrating the main Zig repository from GitHub to Codeberg

ziglang.org

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Re: Migrating the main Zig repository from GitHub to Codeberg

#351

Post by skybrian »

wewewedxfgdf wrote: post #143
zdw wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

None of this means that you have to be on a specific platform. GitHub as default/mandatory is a single point of failure for the entire tech industry. For an example of another language that avoids being entirely coupled into Github, Go has it's real code hosting and CI interaction on a Gerrit instance, with some sync back and forth to GitHub for a few items. The CI pain and operational blindness mentioned in the Zig…

Yeah but marketing matters for Zig because it's still struggling to get significant mindshare. Zig needs to behave more mainstream rather than less and technical gripes about the source hosting platform should not matter more than marketing.

Maybe, but isn't it too soon to be mainstream anyway? Until the language and standard libraries hit 1.0, it seems like Zig is for early adopters. Having too many of the wrong kind of users is just going to be frustrating for everyone.

Re: Migrating the main Zig repository from GitHub to Codeberg

#352

Post by ttiurani »

Looking at these comments, it's painfully apparent how many think that being polite in your communication is more important than actually doing something.

I agree it would have been nicer if the message was more polite. But if you compare that to having the backbone follow through with meaningful long-term changes against a corporation you don't trust or respect, there shouldn't even be a discussion.

And don't even get me started with the people who come in here just to point out that Codeberg isn't perfect either.

Re: Migrating the main Zig repository from GitHub to Codeberg

#353

Post by hiddencost »

quantummagic wrote: post #176
ericpruitt wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amusingly, this post violates Zig's own code of conduct: https://ziglang.org/code-of-conduct > Examples of behavior that contribute to creating a positive environment include: > - Using welcoming and inclusive language. > - Being respectful of differing viewpoints and experiences. > - Showing empathy towards others. > - Showing appreciation for others’ work.

Codes of conduct are perfunctory virtue signalling. Do we really need a unique set of "rules" posted on every project? They all sound like they were written by the same AI bot. That said, it's telling that the Zig leader can't even follow them. The rules should just be taken down.

[flagged]

Re: Migrating the main Zig repository from GitHub to Codeberg

#354

Post by kajika91 »

This is a very good move, using more open technology benefits everyone in the long run.

Aside from the bitter words against Github (and I read comments here forgetting about the very real consequences with people lives like collaboration with ICE), using codeberg is using Forgejo : those technology are by us and for us. Unlike Github we can run our own if necessary and all the technology (actions and such) can be improved and be shared between us.

An other benefit of Forgejo/Codeberg is the absence of pushing for paying more, Github is not free and lives of users going to Azure/Gemini or other Mircrosoft services. There are many parts that are made/changed to nudge people into paying more and more and be vendor-locked.

I like my life to have the fewest dark patterns as possible and Coderberg is extremely helpful.

Re: Migrating the main Zig repository from GitHub to Codeberg

#355

Post by brendoelfrendo »

wilg wrote: post #270
brendoelfrendo wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because they deserve to know they're making the world a worse place.

GitHub is definitely not making the world a worse place. Touch grass.

Ok, fine; that was hyperbole. They are incrementally making their product worse in very visible ways and for some reason refuse to fix it or change course. I mean, in introducing these inconveniences to their users they are technically making the world worse, but sure, not in a way that matters.

Re: Migrating the main Zig repository from GitHub to Codeberg

#356

Post by bayesnet »

Quothling wrote: post #347
wewewedxfgdf wrote: post #126

Very questionable decision. You're running what aims to be a major programming language - have it where people expect and live with your gripes about the platform. In retail you set up your store in the biggest mall with the most customers walking past - sure you can go set up in some back alley but don't expect customers to come to your store. This remains true even if the mall owns forget to mop the floor. This fee…

Who are people? People in USA? Where I live it's frankly a positive if you're on a different base than github. SQLite seems to manage fine without github, so I'm not sure why you think Zig isn't going to be. That being said I don't necessarily disagree with your position on maturity, SQLite has an official github mirror after all. Even if you don't want to bother with that there are a lot of ways to write about it wi…

SQLite doesn’t really accept PRs[0], so I don’t think is comparable here. The SQLite model is great for their purposes but I doubt it’s suited to a community-based open contribution setup.

[0]: https://sqlite.org/copyright.html#:~:text=Open%2DSource%2C%2...

Re: Migrating the main Zig repository from GitHub to Codeberg

#357

Post by Quothling »

pikdum wrote: post #305

I'm not a fan of GitHub Actions either, but is there actually anything better nowadays? I've just come to accept it as the best of bad options.

I don't like Azure DevOps or it's pipelines (the yaml ones, not the classic drag and drop that is now disabled by default), but I like it a lot more than github actions. I doubt we'd ever really use github actions for security reasons, but I do prefer the explicit behaviors and templating with structure with azure compared to how Github Actions tries to solve change management with digitalisation. I can totally see why github actions would make more sense if you don't have enterprise organisation type AD/Entra + Azure though.

Re: Migrating the main Zig repository from GitHub to Codeberg

#358

Post by brendoelfrendo »

wilg wrote: post #277
sapphicsnail wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're mad because they left a vendor because they switched to a different vendor that you think is just as bad but also you're accusing them of starting an "inevitable purity spiral?" Which one is it?

It's not in conflict. They are pointing out that in this case their stated goal was not achieved so it's pointless.

It wasn't their stated goal, if you read linked article. The commenter got it wrong.

Re: Migrating the main Zig repository from GitHub to Codeberg

#359

Post by xp84 »

harry8 wrote: post #330
ericpruitt wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amusingly, this post violates Zig's own code of conduct: https://ziglang.org/code-of-conduct > Examples of behavior that contribute to creating a positive environment include: > - Using welcoming and inclusive language. > - Being respectful of differing viewpoints and experiences. > - Showing empathy towards others. > - Showing appreciation for others’ work.

There is a difference between what you say to and about volunteers working for free on their hobby and what you say about the work of a company famously known as "The Death Star" You want to work with people and the group says "yay and this is how we will work together" you do that or go away. This is entirely separate to stating a universal truth such as "Microsoft product blows because they do not care", "Oracle su…

I have no connection to Microsoft but I think this take is terrible.

Part of maturing and growing up, for me, was realizing that there are really very few people who truly deserve scorn and disrespect[1]. Those I disagree with politically, mostly think they’re doing the right thing and they think that if people only understood, they’d change their tune (and that’s basically what I think of them). Those “big companies” like Microsoft, Atlassian, etc, their incentives line up - and literally must line up - in a fashion where they make software that frustrates many users constantly. It really isn’t malice or incompetence - no one, from the intern that wrote some snippet of JS on GitHub dot com, to Satya Nadella, is either intentionally phoning it in nor waking up in the morning asking himself, “how can I frustrate the efforts of people out there?”

And anyway, because most people are trying their best, regardless of how the outcomes line up to affect my life and my interests personally, really do not deserve my scorn and derision. If I were in their situations, very little if anything would actually change. So spouting insults at these people who I don’t know, and whose roles I don’t really understand, is really not a mature, productive, nor fair thing to do.

[1] if you are curious I’d say murderers, etc. dominate that group.

Re: Migrating the main Zig repository from GitHub to Codeberg

#360

Post by WesolyKubeczek »

Nathanba wrote: post #229
DANmode wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ll take that vs no open source software contributors. Elitism is far from the worst character trait unpaid code janitors can be expected to have.

I have a lot of understanding for such personalities too, I'm probably quite like this myself although I try my hardest to not open my mouth like this. For example I got blocked by Jonathan Blow over a simple question on twitter but I don't think too badly of him now, it's just a miscalculation on his part or him trying to optimize his life as a passionate person. But you really need to make sure to be right when you…

> But you really need to make sure to be right when you are putting other people down. I mean REALLY right, you need to tripple check that what you are doing is going to help an honest person to improve themselves.

But it then loses the emotional momentum and stops being colorful!

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