Constant-time support coming to LLVM: Protecting cryptographic code
1–10 of 62 posts
Re: Constant-time support coming to LLVM: Protecting cryptographic code
#2This has been a sore point in a lot of discussions regarding compiler optimizations and cryptographic code, how compilers and compiler engineers are sabotaging the efforts of cryptographers in making sure there are no side-channels in their code. The issue has never been the compiler, and has always been the language: there was never a way to express the right intention from within C (or most other languages, really).
This primitive we're trying to introduce is meant to make up for this shortcoming without having to introduce additional rules in the standard.
Re: Constant-time support coming to LLVM: Protecting cryptographic code
#3This has been a sore point in a lot of discussions regarding compiler optimizations and cryptographic code, how compilers and compiler engineers are sabotaging the efforts of cryptographers in making sure there are no side-channels in their code. The issue has never been the compiler, and has always been the language: there was never a way to express the right intention from within C (or most other languages, really)…
>how compilers and compiler engineers are sabotaging the efforts of cryptographers
I'm not exposed to this space very often, so maybe you or someone else could give me some context. "Sabotage" is a deliberate effort to ruin/hinder something. Are compiler engineers deliberately hindering the efforts of cryptographers? If yes... is there a reason why? Some long-running feud or something?
Or, through the course of their efforts to make compilers faster/etc, are cryptographers just getting the "short end of the stick" so to speak? Perhaps forgotten about because the number of cryptographers is dwarfed by the number of non-cryptographers? (Or any other explanation that I'm unaware of?)
Re: Constant-time support coming to LLVM: Protecting cryptographic code
#4This has been a sore point in a lot of discussions regarding compiler optimizations and cryptographic code, how compilers and compiler engineers are sabotaging the efforts of cryptographers in making sure there are no side-channels in their code. The issue has never been the compiler, and has always been the language: there was never a way to express the right intention from within C (or most other languages, really)…
> how compilers and compiler engineers are sabotaging the efforts of cryptographers I'm not exposed to this space very often, so maybe you or someone else could give me some context. "Sabotage" is a deliberate effort to ruin/hinder something. Are compiler engineers deliberately hindering the efforts of cryptographers? If yes... is there a reason why? Some long-running feud or something? Or, through the course of thei…
It's more a viewpoint thing. Any construct cryptographers find that runs in constant time is something that could be optimized to run faster for non-cryptographic code. Constant-time constructs essentially are optimizer bug reports. There is always the danger that by popularizing a technique you are drawing the attention of a compiler contributor who wants to speed up a benchmark of that same construct in non-cryptographic code. So maybe it's not intended as sabotage, but it can sure feel that way when everything you do is explicitly targeted to be changed after you do it.
Re: Constant-time support coming to LLVM: Protecting cryptographic code
#5This has been a sore point in a lot of discussions regarding compiler optimizations and cryptographic code, how compilers and compiler engineers are sabotaging the efforts of cryptographers in making sure there are no side-channels in their code. The issue has never been the compiler, and has always been the language: there was never a way to express the right intention from within C (or most other languages, really)…
> making sure there are no side-channels in their code
Any side effect is a side channel. There are always going to be side channels in real code running on real hardware.
Sure you can change your code, compiler, or, or even hardware to account for this but at it's core that is security by obscurity.
Re: Constant-time support coming to LLVM: Protecting cryptographic code
#6This has been a sore point in a lot of discussions regarding compiler optimizations and cryptographic code, how compilers and compiler engineers are sabotaging the efforts of cryptographers in making sure there are no side-channels in their code. The issue has never been the compiler, and has always been the language: there was never a way to express the right intention from within C (or most other languages, really)…
> how compilers and compiler engineers are sabotaging the efforts of cryptographers I'm not exposed to this space very often, so maybe you or someone else could give me some context. "Sabotage" is a deliberate effort to ruin/hinder something. Are compiler engineers deliberately hindering the efforts of cryptographers? If yes... is there a reason why? Some long-running feud or something? Or, through the course of thei…
It’s not intentional. The motivations of CPU designers, compiler writers, and optimizers are at odds with those of cryptographers. The former want to use every trick possible to squeeze out additional performance in the most common cases, while the latter absolutely require indistinguishable performance across all possibilities.
CPUs love to do branch prediction to have computation already performed in the case where it guesses the branch correctly, but cryptographic code needs equal performance no matter the input.
When a programmer asks for some register or memory location to be zeroed, they generally just want to be able to use a zero in some later operation and so it doesn’t really matter that a previous value was really overwritten. When a cryptographer does, they generally are trying to make it impossible to read the previous value. And they want to be able to have some guarantee that it wasn’t implicitly copied somewhere else in the interim.
Re: Constant-time support coming to LLVM: Protecting cryptographic code
#7I think __builtin_ct_select and __builtin_ct_expr would be good ideas. (They could also be implemented in GCC in future, as well as LLVM.)
In some cases it might be necessary to consider the possibility of invalid memory accesses (and avoid the side-channels when doing so). (The example given in the article works around this issue, but I don't know if there are any situations where this will not help.)
Re: Constant-time support coming to LLVM: Protecting cryptographic code
#8This has been a sore point in a lot of discussions regarding compiler optimizations and cryptographic code, how compilers and compiler engineers are sabotaging the efforts of cryptographers in making sure there are no side-channels in their code. The issue has never been the compiler, and has always been the language: there was never a way to express the right intention from within C (or most other languages, really)…
> how compilers and compiler engineers are sabotaging the efforts of cryptographers I'm not exposed to this space very often, so maybe you or someone else could give me some context. "Sabotage" is a deliberate effort to ruin/hinder something. Are compiler engineers deliberately hindering the efforts of cryptographers? If yes... is there a reason why? Some long-running feud or something? Or, through the course of thei…
“Sabotage” can be used in a figurative sense that doesn’t insinuate intent. An adjacent example is “self-sabotage”, which doesn’t imply intent.
Re: Constant-time support coming to LLVM: Protecting cryptographic code
#9So this makes me curious: is there a reason we don't do something like a __builtin_ct_begin()/__builtin_ct_end() set of intrinsics? Where the begin intrinsic begins a constant-time code region, and all code within that region must be constant-time, and that region must be ended with an end() call? I'm not too familiar with compiler intrinsics or how these things work so thought I'd ask. The intrinsic could be scoped such that the compiler can use it's implementation-defined behavior freedom to enforce the begin/end pairs. But Idk, maybe this isn't feasible?
Re: Constant-time support coming to LLVM: Protecting cryptographic code
#10I think __builtin_ct_select and __builtin_ct_expr would be good ideas. (They could also be implemented in GCC in future, as well as LLVM.) In some cases it might be necessary to consider the possibility of invalid memory accesses (and avoid the side-channels when doing so). (The example given in the article works around this issue, but I don't know if there are any situations where this will not help.)
The side channel from memory access timings are exactly why cmov is its own instruction on x86_64. It retrieves the memory regardless of the condition value. Anything else would change the timings based on condition. If you're going to segfault that's going to be visible to an attacker regardless because you're going to hang up.