Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

TSMC Arizona outage saw fab halt, Apple wafers scrapped

culpium.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

11–20 of 106 posts

Re: TSMC Arizona outage saw fab halt, Apple wafers scrapped

#11

Post by squigz »

tetha wrote: post #9
tantalor wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good idea for a Factorio mod? A new failure mode resets output progress back to zero if you lose power or some other input while crafting. You could design circuit networks to cut power to non-essential systems so the rest of the factory can keep producing.

Some mods in modded minecraft had that and it's a very punishing mechanic unless implemented well. It eats all of your power and usually also very expensive items very quickly usually. Assume you have like 600RF/tick generated, common with certain generator constellations. 1 tick - 1024 RF and one input consumed, crafting fails due to not enough power. 1 tick wait, 1 tick, 1024 RF and one input consumed, ... This can…

Out of curiosity, which mods are this cruel? I've been playing GT (modern) lately and even it doesn't void your machine's items unless you break the machine itself.

Re: TSMC Arizona outage saw fab halt, Apple wafers scrapped

#12

Post by agentifysh »

seems like what is often downplayed or silent on American media is the cultural mismatch between TSMC taiwanese engineers and their american counterparts

so it always comes to those out of the loop as a bit of a surprise but from what I've read from individual Taiwanese workers and their feedback its clear that there is significant regret from one side.

and it doesn't seem to limited to just TSMC but another large company as of recent that receive icey reception for their large investment in America manufacturing.

i think this is a big reason why lot of these jobs simply wouldn't stay in america as the consumer would not be able to foot the costs added by "cultural premium" faster than what innovation can reduce.

Re: TSMC Arizona outage saw fab halt, Apple wafers scrapped

#13

Post by samus »

joecool1029 wrote: post #8
taurath wrote: post #2

In September

But first being reported now: It was only speculation on the financial reports before this. How quickly do they normally report disruptions like this? I wouldn't think it would have to be too quickly since I've heard about fab disruptions from fires and such since the early 2000's. Probably just sometime after quarterly reporting to set the record straight? Why not in the report?

I also had the impression from the report that shareholders were miffed about this Q3 snag, so they had to publish this even though they were about to treat this as business as usual.

Re: TSMC Arizona outage saw fab halt, Apple wafers scrapped

#15

Post by itake »

agentifysh wrote: post #12

seems like what is often downplayed or silent on American media is the cultural mismatch between TSMC taiwanese engineers and their american counterparts so it always comes to those out of the loop as a bit of a surprise but from what I've read from individual Taiwanese workers and their feedback its clear that there is significant regret from one side. and it doesn't seem to limited to just TSMC but another large co…

Perhaps if the US workers earned OT like TW workers do, the "culture" gap would shrink.

Re: TSMC Arizona outage saw fab halt, Apple wafers scrapped

#18

Post by squigz »

hofrogs wrote: post #10
tetha wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some mods in modded minecraft had that and it's a very punishing mechanic unless implemented well. It eats all of your power and usually also very expensive items very quickly usually. Assume you have like 600RF/tick generated, common with certain generator constellations. 1 tick - 1024 RF and one input consumed, crafting fails due to not enough power. 1 tick wait, 1 tick, 1024 RF and one input consumed, ... This can…

GregTech doesn't use RF though, at least it didn't. Machines pull packets of amps through the wires from the generators/batteries, the whole system is pretty interesting. Also high-level circuits have to be manufactured in cleanrooms with a pretty complex tech chain.

I think GP just used RF as an example and was only referring to GT as a comparison in difficulty.

GT's system of only pulling power on-demand is very nice though; no wasting fuel

Re: TSMC Arizona outage saw fab halt, Apple wafers scrapped

#19

Post by Kye »

bob1029 wrote: post #3

> forcing the facility to shut down for at least a few hours > As a result, the company had to scrap thousands of wafers Anything involving wet chemistry, photoresist, furnaces, etc. is very time-constrained. You can't let wafers sit around indefinitely. Certain process steps must be followed up very quickly to avoid scrap. This is why you dont see redundant power for manufacturing lines. A 3nm line needs hundreds of…

A video showing those steps, for the curious: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dX9CGRZwD-w

It's probably not 100% identical to TSMC's process.

Re: TSMC Arizona outage saw fab halt, Apple wafers scrapped

#20

Post by sevensor »

bob1029 wrote: post #3

> forcing the facility to shut down for at least a few hours > As a result, the company had to scrap thousands of wafers Anything involving wet chemistry, photoresist, furnaces, etc. is very time-constrained. You can't let wafers sit around indefinitely. Certain process steps must be followed up very quickly to avoid scrap. This is why you dont see redundant power for manufacturing lines. A 3nm line needs hundreds of…

It didn’t happen, but the facilities team at the fab where I worked was seriously considering installing a flywheel to cover power bumps. What I don’t get about this story is how this actually happened. All our process gasses were out in a tank farm and we knew how much pressure we had. We would have stopped the line if there wasn’t enough to proceed. Were they separating air onsite or something?
Post reply on HN