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Japan's gamble to turn island of Hokkaido into global chip hub

bbc.com

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Re: Japan's gamble to turn island of Hokkaido into global chip hub

#231

Post by ivell »

mytailorisrich wrote: post #193
ivell wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If historical claims are valid, then Mongols would be very happy to claim large swaths of land. Or if more recent claims are to be taken, then the Brits have claims over quite a large amount of countries. Historical claims are meaningless and are just an excuse for expansion.

I did not comment on the "validity" of the claim, just explained its rationale and history. Chinese territorial claims in general are not "an excuse for expansion", they are rooted in territorial losses at the end of the 19th century and during the revolution of 1912 with the formal aim of recovering them. They also predate the PRC as you'll find that the ROC/Taiwan has the same claims for the same reason. This does…

> This does not mean that China is going to go to war over them, certainly it won't go to war with India.

Then why make a claim? Claims are made to prepare the domestic audience so that when war comes there is home support for the action. It is not made lightly.

The Chinese are definitely taking action in the South China Sea. It is not just words.

Re: Japan's gamble to turn island of Hokkaido into global chip hub

#233

Post by keepamovin »

RobotToaster wrote: post #204
keepamovin wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a fair point if you only start the clock in 1949, but it's not scaremongering. It's pattern recognition over 3,000 years. The territory we now call "China" is the product of relentless expansion and assimilation. Tibet, Xinjiang, Inner Mongolia,d , Manchuria, much of the southwest... none were historically Han or Mandarin-speaking. Beijing's own justification is usually "they were Chinese all along" (because "…

> It's pattern recognition over 3,000 years. Now do the same for the USA, UK, Japan, Italy, Turkey, etc.

Right. There's no clan that's blameless. All our current progress stands on a mountain of blood and death. Humanity is drenched in war. Is that all we can ever be?

Re: Japan's gamble to turn island of Hokkaido into global chip hub

#234

Post by mytailorisrich »

ivell wrote: post #231
mytailorisrich wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did not comment on the "validity" of the claim, just explained its rationale and history. Chinese territorial claims in general are not "an excuse for expansion", they are rooted in territorial losses at the end of the 19th century and during the revolution of 1912 with the formal aim of recovering them. They also predate the PRC as you'll find that the ROC/Taiwan has the same claims for the same reason. This does…

> This does not mean that China is going to go to war over them, certainly it won't go to war with India. Then why make a claim? Claims are made to prepare the domestic audience so that when war comes there is home support for the action. It is not made lightly. The Chinese are definitely taking action in the South China Sea. It is not just words.

> Claims are made to prepare the domestic audience so that when war comes there is home support for the action. It is not made lightly.

That's your opinion, not reality.

Re: Japan's gamble to turn island of Hokkaido into global chip hub

#235

Post by aurareturn »

noduerme wrote: post #201
aurareturn wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

because Taiwan intends to violently and militarily resist if it comes to that I doubt Taiwan truly wants to do this. It has more to do with the US wanting to use Taiwan as a pawn to contain China's power.

If you lived in a country with local political representation and free elections, would you want your children to grow up in slavery to a dictatorship across the sea? Ask the Irish.

China has already said they'd allow one country two systems.

Re: Japan's gamble to turn island of Hokkaido into global chip hub

#236

Post by mrweasel »

watwut wrote: post #118
abc123abc123 wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hah... europe will become king of the world! We'll tax and regulate ourselves to enormous wealth! No... jokes aside, europe is a failed union, and will slowly collapse or decompose in a decade or two. Then we can again focus on trade, lowering taxs and creating value. The only thing that is happening now is that the political class has become enormously rich through bribes and by having managed to phase out democracy…

You mean, like America is doing right now while simultaneously destroying its international position and quality of life?

Right now, sitting in Europe, wishing that Brussels was just ever so slightly more functional, you look out into the world and see how everyone else is doing, and you're reminded that things isn't actually that bad.

Re: Japan's gamble to turn island of Hokkaido into global chip hub

#237

Post by anonymous908213 »

agentifysh wrote: post #30

isn't it risky to build this in a seismically active region? wouldn't somewhere that has almost no history of earthquakes like korea be better?

I believe Koreans would find being colonized again to be at least a little bit objectionable.

Hokkaido is significantly safer compared to Honshu. It does still experience quakes, but it is at least not directly on major fault lines.

Re: Japan's gamble to turn island of Hokkaido into global chip hub

#238

Post by zamadatix »

KeplerBoy wrote: post #93
rich_sasha wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would be darkly amusing if all chips come from either politically unstable Taiwan or seismically unstable Hokkaido. But then Japan seems amazing at producing all sorts of other delicate things, despite all of its soil being basically built out of earthquakes, so I guess they have this bit figured out.

Isn't Taiwan also seismically active? They are reports of earthquakes affecting TSMC fabs in january 2025 and april 2024. Apparently these were not huge blows to their fabs, otherwise we would be talking about that day-in-day-out, but there's always a risk of that happening.

Seems even more active, at least according to number of magnitude 6+ earthquakes since 1900 in the region https://earthquake.usgs.gov/earthquakes/map/?extent=12.72608...

Re: Japan's gamble to turn island of Hokkaido into global chip hub

#239

Post by keepamovin »

mikkupikku wrote: post #196
keepamovin wrote: post #166

Maybe we should stop selecting islands next to China to be global critical supply chain hubs. I mean, even if the Chinese were non-expansionist and benevolent, it's still kind of tempting them a little too much.

Who is "we"? Japan doesn't have much choice, they either do things even though they are next to China, or ..what? Maybe its time for people to stop being paralyzed by fear and invest in their future. If China is such a severe threat to Japan, then invest more in the JSDF. Yes, China is powerful and has an aggressive stance, but that's no reason to give up without a fight. Japan and South Korea together can very nearl…

This is more of a humorous take. We already have trouble with one chip nexus is right next to China, and now we build another one? "ha ha". We is humanity. The collective we probably doesn't want a lever of the future controlled by a totalitarian communist ehnostate.

But yes, I agree Japan, Indonesia (as was intended), etc should wise up.

Re: Japan's gamble to turn island of Hokkaido into global chip hub

#240

Post by mono442 »

constantcrying wrote: post #227
sofixa wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're saying that like the two are at odds. France is a military superpower with almost entirely France, worst case scenario western EU, based supply chain. Italy, Spain, to a lesser extent Germany are too. Manufacturing is also pretty strong across (most) of the EU. Automotive is struggling in Germany, but booming in France (Renault are killing it). Leading in Aeronautics too. It's just mostly high value manufactur…

What you are saying is just not true. Frances car industry is dying. Renault is a small company, not even in the top 10 and Stellantis is doing extremely poorly, also affecting Italy's car industry. Within a decade or so COMAC will have a competitive passenger plane, seriously threatening Airbus market share. Germany's entire industry is currently dying since it is impossible to have a cost competitive manufacturing…

High energy prices are a self-imposed problem. The price of electricity is heavily dependent on the price of the most expensive energy source. Electricity from fossil fuels is expensive in European Union due to emissions trading system. A coal-fired power plant pays around 2x more for the emissions than for the coal itself. I don't know how the maths work for a natural gas plant but gas is more expensive in Europe anyway compared to the US.
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