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Japan's gamble to turn island of Hokkaido into global chip hub

bbc.com

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Re: Japan's gamble to turn island of Hokkaido into global chip hub

#21

Post by yanhangyhy »

forgotoldacc wrote: post #17
yanhangyhy wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And they will never become part of China again, ever. They once were, and after World War II they were supposed to be handed over to the Republic of China (Nationalist government), but the Nationalists stupidly refused. Then the United States gave them to Japan as a reward. This completely violated the post-WWII United Nations agreements. So if the UN still wants to claim any legitimacy or relevance, these places sho…

Okinawa was as much a part of China as Botswana and Argentina were. Going back centuries, they've always spoken a japonic language so your government propaganda is a strange approach for seeding justification for invasion in the future.

I never said they speak Chinese or anything like that. in ancient times they were part of China’s tributary system. The Chinese tributary system explicitly allowed different places to keep their own culture and language. It was Japan that annexed them and then systematically destroyed the local culture. The post-WWII agreements (Cairo Declaration, Potsdam Proclamation, San Francisco Peace Treaty framework) all stated that these places was to be stripped from Japan. China is only using this historical fact now to pressure Japan on the propaganda and diplomatic level. No Chinese person actually believes China should (or will) annex them.

All Chinese media are emphasizing that these places do not belong to Japan, not that they belong to China. That’s the essential difference.

Re: Japan's gamble to turn island of Hokkaido into global chip hub

#22

Post by Larrikin »

yanhangyhy wrote: post #13
voidfunc wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Taiwan is different: the vast majority of people there are ethnically Chinese, so reunification is seen as an absolute necessity. Your illegitimate authoritarian government is free to surrender at any time and hand the keys back to the legitimate democratic ROC government then.

yeah its a civil war, lets see who will won. (Thank you for acknowledging that this is a civil war — that's something you rarely see on Western forums.)

Chiang Kai-shek is a standard part of the world history course in the US in high school. We know why China wants Taiwan at the personal level, much of the world is just interested in that not happening.

It's a civil war like the American revolution was a civil war and France helped out.

Re: Japan's gamble to turn island of Hokkaido into global chip hub

#23

Post by yanhangyhy »

Larrikin wrote: post #22
yanhangyhy wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yeah its a civil war, lets see who will won. (Thank you for acknowledging that this is a civil war — that's something you rarely see on Western forums.)

Chiang Kai-shek is a standard part of the world history course in the US in high school. We know why China wants Taiwan at the personal level, much of the world is just interested in that not happening. It's a civil war like the American revolution was a civil war and France helped out.

This is the first time I've ever seen a non-Chinese person say it this way on Reddit, X, or this platform. I must have scrolled through way too much Reddit.

Re: Japan's gamble to turn island of Hokkaido into global chip hub

#24

Post by laughing_man »

jack_tripper wrote: post #16
voidfunc wrote: post #2

Is Hokkaido defensible? Once China solves the Taiwan problem they're going to turn their sights on Korea and Japan.

What's with all this scaremongering around China gonna invade everything anytime soon? How many wars has China started? In my lifetime I've only seen one major county besides Russia having a habbit of starting illegal wars whenever geopolitics doesn't go its way and it's not China.

China has started border skirmishes with India every twenty years or so since the founding of the PRC. And then there's Tibet. Just because they haven't initiated a mass invasion of Eastern Siberia you shouldn't get the idea China isn't pursuing an expansionist foreign policy.

Re: Japan's gamble to turn island of Hokkaido into global chip hub

#25

Post by swordsmith »

yanhangyhy wrote: post #10
voidfunc wrote: post #2

Is Hokkaido defensible? Once China solves the Taiwan problem they're going to turn their sights on Korea and Japan.

> Once China solves the Taiwan problem they're going to turn their sights on Korea and Japan. China will not annex Japan or South Korea. As a Chinese person, I can assure you that this is not how our mindset works at all. Most of the Western media hype about this is deliberately designed to muddy the waters around the Taiwan issue. Taiwan is different: the vast majority of people there are ethnically Chinese, so reun…

> No one wants 125 million thoroughly non-Sinicized Japanese inside the country; that would be seen as an endless headache, not a prize.

I don't think what you claim the people want matters (if even true). Look at Tibet and Xinjiang

Re: Japan's gamble to turn island of Hokkaido into global chip hub

#26

Post by achierius »

yanhangyhy wrote: post #13
voidfunc wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Taiwan is different: the vast majority of people there are ethnically Chinese, so reunification is seen as an absolute necessity. Your illegitimate authoritarian government is free to surrender at any time and hand the keys back to the legitimate democratic ROC government then.

yeah its a civil war, lets see who will won. (Thank you for acknowledging that this is a civil war — that's something you rarely see on Western forums.)

> that's something you rarely see on Western forums.

No, it's quite common.

Re: Japan's gamble to turn island of Hokkaido into global chip hub

#27

Post by yanhangyhy »

achierius wrote: post #26
yanhangyhy wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yeah its a civil war, lets see who will won. (Thank you for acknowledging that this is a civil war — that's something you rarely see on Western forums.)

> that's something you rarely see on Western forums. No, it's quite common.

My personal experience tells me that people are happy to praise China’s achievements in technology and poverty alleviation, but when it comes to the territorial issues of Taiwan, Tibet, and Xinjiang, a completely uniform narrative has already formed. Every single day on Reddit I see a new map of China being Balkanized.

Re: Japan's gamble to turn island of Hokkaido into global chip hub

#28

Post by yanhangyhy »

swordsmith wrote: post #25
yanhangyhy wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Once China solves the Taiwan problem they're going to turn their sights on Korea and Japan. China will not annex Japan or South Korea. As a Chinese person, I can assure you that this is not how our mindset works at all. Most of the Western media hype about this is deliberately designed to muddy the waters around the Taiwan issue. Taiwan is different: the vast majority of people there are ethnically Chinese, so reun…

> No one wants 125 million thoroughly non-Sinicized Japanese inside the country; that would be seen as an endless headache, not a prize. I don't think what you claim the people want matters (if even true). Look at Tibet and Xinjiang

Xinjiang and Tibet have been part of China for many periods throughout history; Japan never was. At most, Korea was merely part of the tributary system. There is a fundamental difference here.

Re: Japan's gamble to turn island of Hokkaido into global chip hub

#29

Post by TulliusCicero »

jack_tripper wrote: post #16
voidfunc wrote: post #2

Is Hokkaido defensible? Once China solves the Taiwan problem they're going to turn their sights on Korea and Japan.

What's with all this scaremongering around China gonna invade everything anytime soon? How many wars has China started? In my lifetime I've only seen one major county besides Russia having a habbit of starting illegal wars whenever geopolitics doesn't go its way and it's not China.

China routinely harasses Vietnamese/Filipino fishing boats IIRC to the point of boarding/assault, and it's expanding its territorial claims in the South China Sea illegally. It hasn't turned into a war yet because so far the other countries have just been taking it on the chin rather than more aggressively defending themselves.

There's a reason why so many countries in that region are very happy to partner with the US for military drills or support.

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