Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

DOE gives Microsoft partner $1B loan to restart Three Mile Island reactor

techcrunch.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

11–20 of 112 posts

Re: DOE gives Microsoft partner $1B loan to restart Three Mile Island reactor

#11

Post by zdragnar »

mmooss wrote: post #8

I wonder what the legal basis of the loan is. Congress controls the money; what authorization does the executive branch have for loaning $1 billion?

It's right in the article:

> The debt facility is being made through the Department of Energy’s Loan Programs Office (LPO), which was formed under the Energy Policy Act of 2005 to foster the growth of clean energy technologies

and, more importantly:

> The Inflation Reduction Act, which passed during the Biden administration, created another pot of money under the LPO known as the Energy Infrastructure Reinvestment program. That program was created to restore existing power plants to operation provided they avoid or reduce pollutants or greenhouse gas emissions. The Trump administration kept it largely in tact, rebranding it the Energy Dominance Financing Program.

Re: DOE gives Microsoft partner $1B loan to restart Three Mile Island reactor

#12

Post by imgabe »

mmooss wrote: post #8

I wonder what the legal basis of the loan is. Congress controls the money; what authorization does the executive branch have for loaning $1 billion?

It's in the article.

> The debt facility is being made through the Department of Energy’s Loan Programs Office (LPO), which was formed under the Energy Policy Act of 2005 to foster the growth of clean energy technologies.

> The Inflation Reduction Act, which passed during the Biden administration, created another pot of money under the LPO known as the Energy Infrastructure Reinvestment program. That program was created to restore existing power plants to operation provided they avoid or reduce pollutants or greenhouse gas emissions. The Trump administration kept it largely in tact, rebranding it the Energy Dominance Financing Program.

Congress passed the Energy Policy act of 2005 and then the Inflation Reduction Act allocating money to the DoE to make these loans.

Re: DOE gives Microsoft partner $1B loan to restart Three Mile Island reactor

#13

Post by int0x29 »

mmooss wrote: post #8

I wonder what the legal basis of the loan is. Congress controls the money; what authorization does the executive branch have for loaning $1 billion?

Looks like this falls under existing congressionally appropriated spending for the DOE

Re: DOE gives Microsoft partner $1B loan to restart Three Mile Island reactor

#14

Post by zdragnar »

CivBase wrote: post #3

How much would it cost to build a new reactor with comparable power output?

Cost varies with the site conditions. It's one of the many things that push nuclear construction costs up; every build needs to take into consideration the geographic nature of the site (bedrock levels, etc) and so every location requires customizations to the design.

With that said, while it doesn't provide numbers, the article does say the refurbishment (costing $1.6 billion, estimated) will be cheaper than a new build. It'll also likely be much faster, projected to open in 2028.

A quick google search puts construction costs of new nuclear of a Unit 2 size in the $5-10 billion range. 3 Mile Island itself was constructed for $2 billion in 2024 inflation-adjusted dollars. All in all, refurbishing sounds like a good bargain compared to a green field build.

Re: DOE gives Microsoft partner $1B loan to restart Three Mile Island reactor

#15

Post by daemonologist »

CivBase wrote: post #3

How much would it cost to build a new reactor with comparable power output?

There's not much to go off of on this subject in the US - only two successful reactor projects have been started since the 70s: Units 3 and 4 at Vogtle in Georgia*. They cost $15 billion each and bankrupted the remnants of Westinghouse (in combination with a similar project in South Carolina which was never finished).

*Many reactors started construction in the 70s and were finished in the 80s or 90s, plus Watts Bar Unit 2 which was started in 1972 and finished in 2016 for a total of $5 billion. The US also of course builds many naval reactors.

Re: DOE gives Microsoft partner $1B loan to restart Three Mile Island reactor

#16

Post by pseudalopex »

comrh wrote: post #9
daemonologist wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unit 2 is the reactor that melted down and it has been shut down ever since (and partially decommissioned). Unit 1, a separate reactor at the same site, was operated normally until 2019 when it was shut down due to high costs. It was originally scheduled to be decommissioned by 2079 (sic) but is now being brought back online.

If it wasn't profitable in 2019, why is profitable now? Because Microsoft is commiting to be a customer?

Microsoft committed to purchase the plant's capacity for 20 years. And US electricity demand grew very slowly from 2005 to 2020. It is growing rapidly now.

Re: DOE gives Microsoft partner $1B loan to restart Three Mile Island reactor

#17

Post by dreamcompiler »

pseudalopex wrote: post #16
comrh wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it wasn't profitable in 2019, why is profitable now? Because Microsoft is commiting to be a customer?

Microsoft committed to purchase the plant's capacity for 20 years. And US electricity demand grew very slowly from 2005 to 2020. It is growing rapidly now.

At around $110/MWh, according to the article. This is about 50% higher than what utility-scale PV or wind would cost. Guess they're using OpenAI accounting.

Re: DOE gives Microsoft partner $1B loan to restart Three Mile Island reactor

#18

Post by ip26 »

dreamcompiler wrote: post #17
pseudalopex wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Microsoft committed to purchase the plant's capacity for 20 years. And US electricity demand grew very slowly from 2005 to 2020. It is growing rapidly now.

At around $110/MWh, according to the article. This is about 50% higher than what utility-scale PV or wind would cost. Guess they're using OpenAI accounting.

I imagine data centers make the best economic sense when they can run full tilt 24/7. You’ll double your payoff time if you can only run work when the sun shines.

Re: DOE gives Microsoft partner $1B loan to restart Three Mile Island reactor

#19

Post by khuey »

tombert wrote: post #2

Maybe someone can elaborate on this, since I know basically nothing about chemistry or nuclear physics; isn't Three Mile Island still completely irradiated and unsafe for humans to inhabit?

No.

Chernobyl (which was a far worse accident) continued to produce power at other units on the same site for 14 years after the meltdown of unit 4.

Post reply on HN