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Our investigation into the suspicious pressure on Archive.today

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Re: Our investigation into the suspicious pressure on Archive.today

#141
post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well then, that would be a very interesting thing to watch when it happens! From the article, the penalty for a false report: > ...shall be punished by one year’s imprisonment and a fine of €15,000. Side note, would anybody know how "easily" do political elites get off the hook in France?

But apparently there was actual CSAM there, since the article mentioned that archive.is removed it within a few hours. So the claim was real. Why did they make up such a story around it?

Because they went to the unrelated DNS provider and not the archive itself.

Re: Our investigation into the suspicious pressure on Archive.today

#142
post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The current federal government in the USA actively encourages federal agents to use illegal and unethical methods, and promised them protection and immunity.

The current federal government of France? Of the EU? The article is not about the USA.

> The current federal government of France? Of the EU? The article is not about the USA.

Are you sure ? They say in the article that they were not able to fing out who sent the email. Site was behind Cloudfare (so US).

Re: Our investigation into the suspicious pressure on Archive.today

#143
post #46

The amount of forces seemingly actively trying to kill the internet of old is disconcerting. Chat control, DNS as arbiter of whats allowed, walled gardens etc.

The internet will be destroyed as countries the world over seek to impose all of their silly and incompatible laws on it. The international network will fracture into multiple national networks with heavy filtering at the borders. I've been making this prediction for years now. Words can hardly capture the sadness I feel when I see evidence of its slow realization. I'm happy to have known the true internet. Truly one…

> The internet will be destroyed as countries the world over seek to impose all of their silly and incompatible laws on it.

> I'm happy to have known the true internet. Truly one of the wonders of humanity.

I'm old enough to have been around for the whole thing. I used to kind of share this view, but I don't anymore.

I think it's impossible to reconcile this point of view with the obvious observation that huge aspects of life have gotten really dramatically worse thanks to the internet and its related and successor technologies.

It has made people more addicted, more anxious, more divided, or confused. It has created massive concentrations of wealth and power that have a very damaging effect on society, and it is drastically reducing the ability of people to make decisions about how they want to live and how they want their society to be structured.

It's also done a tremendous amount of positive good, too, don't worry. It's obvious to me, like it should be obvious to any rational person, that there are huge benefits too. And of course, to some extent, there's a bit of inevitability to some parts of this.

While certainly there are examples of silly laws in the world, it's worth noting that that's the exception, not the rule. In general, laws are things that society does on purpose with the intent of making the world match its values.

I think countries should in fact be governed by the consent of their own citizens and by the rule of law. I welcome changes that make that more likely.

I also like Archive.today, and I hate paywalls, they're annoying. This may not be the best place to post my counterpoint, but I think it's worth mentioning and it doesn't get repeated enough.

I was around in the 90s, and I'm very familiar with the techno-utopian approach of the first internet generation. It failed.

Re: Our investigation into the suspicious pressure on Archive.today

#144
post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well then, that would be a very interesting thing to watch when it happens! From the article, the penalty for a false report: > ...shall be punished by one year’s imprisonment and a fine of €15,000. Side note, would anybody know how "easily" do political elites get off the hook in France?

But apparently there was actual CSAM there, since the article mentioned that archive.is removed it within a few hours. So the claim was real. Why did they make up such a story around it?

Since archive.is doesn’t scan the internet and only archives content on demand, those might as well have been planted exactly for this purpose - which would put another crime onto the accuser.

Re: Our investigation into the suspicious pressure on Archive.today

#145
post #98
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How about "The President was close friends with a known child sexual predator and his entire government spends a significant amount of time covering up their connections because it seems fairly obvious the president fucked teenagers and then fomented a coup and put literal criminals and felons in his cabinet so no one would hold him accountable while destroying the nation's economy and starting wars nobody can even u…

[flagged]

>with the evidence from the emails we can upgrade it to the much more direct fact "President Trump is a pedophile who liked to rape little girls"

A bunch of vaguely worded emails is enough to summarily conclude that someone is a criminal? I'm glad you're not a judge.

Re: Our investigation into the suspicious pressure on Archive.today

#146

Its interesting that being unable to find a legal route to dig up dirt on archive.is, they're going the route of CSAM allegations. I first heard of this technique on a discussion on Lowendtalk from a hoster discussing how pressure campaigns were orchestrated. The host used to host VMs for a customer that was not well liked but otherwise within the bounds of free speech in the US (I guess something on the order of KF/…

They have plausible deniability, but the fact of the matter is: this also erases evidence of past crimes from public records. If bad things already happened then we should keep the evidence that they happened. The root problem of CSAM is child trafficking and abuse in physical space. But for whatever reason enforcement efforts seem to be more focused on censoring and deleting the images rather than on curbing the act…

Great point. I guess one is just a better anti-privacy boogeyman.

Re: Our investigation into the suspicious pressure on Archive.today

#147

Its interesting that being unable to find a legal route to dig up dirt on archive.is, they're going the route of CSAM allegations. I first heard of this technique on a discussion on Lowendtalk from a hoster discussing how pressure campaigns were orchestrated. The host used to host VMs for a customer that was not well liked but otherwise within the bounds of free speech in the US (I guess something on the order of KF/…

They have plausible deniability, but the fact of the matter is: this also erases evidence of past crimes from public records. If bad things already happened then we should keep the evidence that they happened. The root problem of CSAM is child trafficking and abuse in physical space. But for whatever reason enforcement efforts seem to be more focused on censoring and deleting the images rather than on curbing the act…

[deleted]

Re: Our investigation into the suspicious pressure on Archive.today

#148
post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, as the post indicates, it likely isn't from a government body.

I thought they were suggesting it was a government body (an FBI operation)

I understood that they suspect a lone unknown criminal, and that they filed a police report based on that suspicion.

Re: Our investigation into the suspicious pressure on Archive.today

#149
post #59

So they're pressuring a DNS resolver to block a specific website? That seems like an incredibly slippery slope. What stops them from forcing Chrome to block the website, or LetsEncrypt to not issue any more certificates for the domain, or Microsoft and Apple to add them to their firewalls? Hell, can they go after the infrastructure software developers and say, force nginx to add a check and refuse to serve the domain…

We already did the slipping. Sony sued Quad9 to have them block The Pirate Bay. They only lost after a lengthy legal exchange.

There's also voluntary censorship, so without any real due process, in some countries. Mostly at ISP level, but all the other entities you mentioned could also implement it. They may be forced to, as a means of dodging liability. There's all kinds of nefarious schemes.

Re: Our investigation into the suspicious pressure on Archive.today

#150
post #63
post #46

The amount of forces seemingly actively trying to kill the internet of old is disconcerting. Chat control, DNS as arbiter of whats allowed, walled gardens etc.

Don’t forget cloudflare

Yes. Alas my list was far from exhaustive :(
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