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Bitchat for Gaza – messaging without internet

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Re: Bitchat for Gaza – messaging without internet

#201

Post by immibis »

vladgur wrote: post #198
immibis wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Israelis live in Palestine though - it's just that any area they live gets renamed from "Palestine" to "Israel", usually accompanied by heavily artillery fire and drone strikes, to clear out the natives.

I wish more people were upfront with the truth like you are. A very sensible interpretation of your words is a) All land between Jordan river and mediterranean sea should be called Palestine b) only Arabs are natives of that lands. Here b) is plainly wrong -- Both arabs and jews continuously lived in that area for hundreds and for Jews -- thousands -- of years. and a) implies that the state of Israel does not have a…

I didn't say Jews. You said Jews. I said Israelis. I don't care what their religion is - bombing all the hospitals and universities in a region and drone striking little babies is terrible horrible no no very bad stuff.

By the way, if we're talking about tribalism, the distant descendants of the Jews who lived in that area thousands of years ago, are (largely) the Palestinians. The modern Israelis are (largely) an entirely separate group of white Europeans that immigrated from Europe after WW2.

Re: Bitchat for Gaza – messaging without internet

#202

Post by shmulkey18 »

hashim wrote: post #190
rick312 wrote: post #189

[flagged]

So standing soldiers of the occupying army taken from a military kibbutz mere miles from the world's largest open air concentration camp? Hind al-Rajab was 6 years old and was found with hundreds of bullets inside her body. This is not a game Israel can afford to play, so let's just rewind to the beginning and ask how many the Irgun and Haganah killed and bombed to strong-arm the British into giving them Palestine? O…

Odd that you talk about concentration camps when the George Washington of Palestinian nationalism collaborated with Hitler and help recruit Muslim SS troops in order to commit actual genocide.

"In 1941, Haj Amin al-Husseini fled to Germany and met with Adolf Hitler, Heinrich Himmler, Joachim Von Ribbentrop and other Nazi leaders. He wanted to persuade them to extend the Nazis’ anti-Jewish program to the Arab world." -- https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/the-mufti-and-the-f-uum....

Projection is an interesting phenomena.

Re: Bitchat for Gaza – messaging without internet

#203

Post by vladgur »

immibis wrote: post #134
vladgur wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So that interest was actualized through removing all Jews -- living and dead -- from Gaza in 2005?

Sure. Just look at how they're doing now: they have the full support of the world to re-invade Gaza, and this can be justified by the fact that no Jews live there (Just look three comments above yours: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45932249 ) If there were Israeli Jews (I am not referring to the religious group, but by which side of the conflict people are on) living in Gaza, such arguments wouldn't work, just…

Lets make the order of operatons clear.

1) Hamas started a war with Israel by invading it, slaughtering and raping hundreds of civilians at the music festival and in their homes as well as taking hundreds of civilians hostage, including as we all know an toddlers, womens and elderly.

2) Israel in order to rescue its citizens as well as protect them from future attacked invaded Gaza and attacked Hammas and its infrastructure

So yeah, it makes sense to support the country trying to rescue its hostages from an enemy government.

We can debate how Israel prosecutes the war, but its a war that Hamas started and yet in your accusation of Israel above there is no mention of role Gazan goverment -- Hamas -- played in this war.

I doubt that my country -- the US -- would prosecute the war any better, had it been invaded by thousands of Mexican federales killing 42,000 people -- an equivalent of population the city of Cupertino where Apple is headquartered -- while kidnapping 9,000 of our citizens. I doubt any country would do better as a matter of fact.

Re: Bitchat for Gaza – messaging without internet

#204

Post by RandomNickname »

hashim wrote: post #188
praptak wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even in Ukraine it's quite possible to code. I worked at Google with people who stayed in Ukraine after Russia started the war. I can't say they were unaffected - there was stuff like meetings interrupted by missile alerts - but they managed to do normal work despite the ongoing war.

[flagged]

[flagged]

Re: Bitchat for Gaza – messaging without internet

#205

Post by immibis »

nickff wrote: post #172
berdario wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

40% of the bombing victims in Gaza are under 10 years old https://msf.org.uk/article/gaza-msf-survey-shows-almost-half... Comparing it to the war in Ukraine ("Even in Ukraine") isn't really helpful or informative, to understand the condition under which Palestinians are surviving.

The website you linked to specifies a subtly different thing from what you’re asserting: > ”Forty-eight percent of the people who died from blast injuries among our colleagues' households were children and 40 percent were under 10 years old.” That is quite different from saying that “ 40% of the bombing victims in Gaza are under 10 years old”.

Can you clarify the difference between "bombing victims" and "people who died from blast injuries"? I'm not seeing it.

Re: Bitchat for Gaza – messaging without internet

#206

Post by hashim »

shmulkey18 wrote: post #200
hashim wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fair enough, that particular kibbutz is not military, but most in the vicinity around Gaza were, and as I'm sure you know, the killed hostages along with most adult Israelis were either serving or former members of the IDF, the army of the occupying state that was formed by the merging of the Irgun and Haganah and still shares much of the same people and ideologies. Yes, both of those kids were killed by Israel as cl…

The defense of murder, rape, Holocaust denial, blood libels -- all grist for the Bitchat for Gaza and HN mill. Man, what a tidal wave of antisemitism we're experiencing.

Yes, antisemitism, in the same way it was anti-Americanism for the Viet Cong to resist the American occupation of Vietnam and that famous terrorist Mandela to resist apartheid South Africa. Desperate people who have heinous things done on them for 70 years do desperate, heinous things, and no-one is more desperate and more wronged than the Palestinians. Again, 70 years. It's almost like Europeans don't belong in the Middle East. Remind me what Netanyahu's real name is again? Also, since I'm sure you wouldn't want to be intellectually dishonest, I'm sure you no doubt equally agree that any criticism of Saudi Arabia, if it were doing anything remotely as heinous as Israel has for the last 70 years, would be Islamophobia, right? Right?

Re: Bitchat for Gaza – messaging without internet

#207

Post by immibis »

RandomNickname wrote: post #204
hashim wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

[flagged]

People are concerned about Palestine because we're the ones doing it indirectly. It's not US or European troops on the ground, but it's almost entirely funded by the US and Europe and our governments fully support it and help it to keep going. Whereas the war in Sudan, while also very bad, isn't our fault. Maybe if we could get our own governments to stop bombing little children, after that we could consider intervening to stop other governments from bombing little children, but as it is, we can't even get past step 1.

Re: Bitchat for Gaza – messaging without internet

#208

Post by hashim »

RandomNickname wrote: post #204
hashim wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

[flagged]

Has Sudan also been going on 70 years with the help of the Brits and active funding of the Americans, then? Have hundreds of thousands died in any country and even more expelled (ethnically cleansed) in the world since 1948 apart from Palestine? No? Then your whataboutism is childish and your deflection is obvious.

Re: Bitchat for Gaza – messaging without internet

#209

Post by hdlothia »

immibis wrote: post #205
nickff wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The website you linked to specifies a subtly different thing from what you’re asserting: > ”Forty-eight percent of the people who died from blast injuries among our colleagues' households were children and 40 percent were under 10 years old.” That is quite different from saying that “ 40% of the bombing victims in Gaza are under 10 years old”.

Can you clarify the difference between "bombing victims" and "people who died from blast injuries"? I'm not seeing it.

It says the dataset is 'colleague's households' which might be different from all of gaza.

Re: Bitchat for Gaza – messaging without internet

#210

Post by JumpCrisscross »

berdario wrote: post #160
praptak wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even in Ukraine it's quite possible to code. I worked at Google with people who stayed in Ukraine after Russia started the war. I can't say they were unaffected - there was stuff like meetings interrupted by missile alerts - but they managed to do normal work despite the ongoing war.

40% of the bombing victims in Gaza are under 10 years old https://msf.org.uk/article/gaza-msf-survey-shows-almost-half... Comparing it to the war in Ukraine ("Even in Ukraine") isn't really helpful or informative, to understand the condition under which Palestinians are surviving.

> Comparing it to the war in Ukraine ("Even in Ukraine") isn't really helpful or informative

Why not?

40% of bombing victims in Gaza are under 10. What fraction of the population is? How does that compare to Ukraine’s demographic and bombing victim distributions?

These are valid questions for contextualising a conflict.

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