Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Being poor vs. being broke

blog.ctms.me

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

161–170 of 732 posts

Re: Being poor vs. being broke

#161

Post by moralestapia »

wagwang wrote: post #133
ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #15

I like this guy’s backstory[0]. I grew up in Africa. The poverty I saw, as a child, was foundational in my own personal development. There are some places in the US, that have that kind of poverty, but I have not seen them, with my own eyes. I have family that dedicated most of their life to fighting poverty (with very limited success). They believe that poverty is probably the single biggest problem in the world, to…

My parents grew up poor in manner that is more extreme than anything OP described in the post and they always remind me that its just hard work and grit.

>its just hard work and grit

Which country, though?

Because that's like 90% of the solution.

The other 9% is good health.

The remaining 1% is a mix of your community/family/friends and, sure, hard work and grit and whatnot.

Re: Being poor vs. being broke

#162

Post by tracker1 »

JohnMakin wrote: post #97
tracker1 wrote: post #83

While I get it, I disagree with some of the premise... especially the idea of working two jobs. My dad has worked multiple jobs at a time when I was growing up... I've worked multiple jobs at a time as recently as this year. Now, I'm getting old (50yo) and really couldn't handle it as well as I could in my 20s, but I still did it. It's not a permanent solution, but it's not a bad thing to do when you need to in order…

Lots of low skill jobs have constantly shifting schedules given at the last possible minute (day by day sometimes) that don’t necessarily allow the time luxury of juggling multiple jobs. Fast food is a great example.

Not sure about that even.. in my late teens I worked fast food and as a clerical temp worker (I could type fast) for data entry/processing. The fast food job didn't have an issue scheduling me just in the evenings/weekends.

A lot of employers are pretty understanding if you have multiple jobs and will work around your needs as much as possible.

Re: Being poor vs. being broke

#163

Post by zarl »

reaperducer wrote: post #40
ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #15

I like this guy’s backstory[0]. I grew up in Africa. The poverty I saw, as a child, was foundational in my own personal development. There are some places in the US, that have that kind of poverty, but I have not seen them, with my own eyes. I have family that dedicated most of their life to fighting poverty (with very limited success). They believe that poverty is probably the single biggest problem in the world, to…

There are some places in the US, that have that kind of poverty, but I have not seen them, with my own eyes. Americans are very often blind to the poverty in their own backyards. There are hundreds of thousands (millions?) of people in America who do not have electricity or even running water in their homes. I'm always reminded of a photograph from a few years ago in the Navajo Times showing a handful of children sit…

> There are hundreds of thousands (millions?) of people in America who do not have electricity or even running water in their homes.

This is just not true. America has many problems but access to electricity/running water simply is not one of them.

Re: Being poor vs. being broke

#164

Post by pixl97 »

peterspath wrote: post #140
pixl97 wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>If you're poor and unsucessful, that means you didn't work hard enough, you must be lazy.". Calvinism. Your poor because you're bad. Interestingly enough Calvinism serves as a lot of the basis for what became Capitalism.

where can I read more about it? I don't see the connection, but I could be wrong, so interested in some reading on this topic.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reformed_Christianity

and

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Predestination_in_Calvinism

Re: Being poor vs. being broke

#165

Post by carlosjobim »

ModernMech wrote: post #113
baq wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Americans are very often blind to the poverty in their own backyards. it doesn't help that it's in practice illegal to be in such poverty.

If anyone is wondering why solving homelessness and poverty is so hard, this sibling reply is dead but I think people need to see that this opinion exists, and we need to contemplate the richest and most powerful people in this country share this sentiment: "we're not blind to it, half of us are sick of paying for it for multiple generations, accruing interest. we're paying for poor people from 20 years ago still. le…

It's nobody's fault for becoming poor. But if you're staying poor (dirt poor) for decades, then there is something you're doing wrong. The other commenter puts it in a rude way, but there's something to it. If you evidently can't take care of yourself, then you shouldn't be given more money. You should be in some kind of institution which takes care of your basic needs.

Re: Being poor vs. being broke

#166

Post by tome »

monero-xmr wrote: post #138
smithkl42 wrote: post #13

The post does a good job of describing a phenomenological difference between being broke and being poor, and its account seems plausible to me. But what I'm curious about is the causal difference between the two. I've known working class folks who seem like they're getting by fine, even if they're occasionally "broke", and I've known working class folks who are constantly in financial crisis, and definitely fit in th…

I’m wealthy but I wasnt always. When I was 22 through 30 I didn’t take a single vacation that wasn’t driving to a long weekend. My wife and I both pulled 60 to 70 hour weeks for our entire 20s (I still do). No one “deserves” free time. If you don’t want to work 70 hours a week and want to watch Netflix instead, go for it, but don’t bitch to me

I'm confused because the comment you're replying to didn't mention free time or Netflix.

Re: Being poor vs. being broke

#167

Post by gnarlouse »

Another point the author doesn't make but probably should is the home economics of DIY: A solo person gets 24h a day, just like everybody else. Ideally 8 are spent asleep. Another 8 (minimum) are probably spent working. That leaves a person 8 hours to do their whole life. It eats away at personal time, it bleeds into work and sleep, often by interrupting or occluding the ability to do either.

Re: Being poor vs. being broke

#168

Post by raffael_de »

pixl97 wrote: post #94
netsharc wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Too many people buy the American dream of "If you just work hard enough, you'll be successful.". If you believe this, then you'd have to believe the opposite: "If you're poor and unsucessful, that means you didn't work hard enough, you must be lazy.". And too many trust-fund kids or kids from rich parents who could afford to send them to expensive schools (or rich enough to live in a district with a well-funded schoo…

>If you're poor and unsucessful, that means you didn't work hard enough, you must be lazy.". Calvinism. Your poor because you're bad. Interestingly enough Calvinism serves as a lot of the basis for what became Capitalism.

Homeless people are famously just temporarily inconvenienced millionaires.

Re: Being poor vs. being broke

#169

Post by steveBK123 »

ModernMech wrote: post #113
baq wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Americans are very often blind to the poverty in their own backyards. it doesn't help that it's in practice illegal to be in such poverty.

If anyone is wondering why solving homelessness and poverty is so hard, this sibling reply is dead but I think people need to see that this opinion exists, and we need to contemplate the richest and most powerful people in this country share this sentiment: "we're not blind to it, half of us are sick of paying for it for multiple generations, accruing interest. we're paying for poor people from 20 years ago still. le…

I often find the loudest voices with this mentality either come from well off families, or were poor enough themselves in childhood to have benefited from the government programs they wish to destroy. The first is ignorance and the second is some sort of self hatred / shame.

I rarely hear people that grew up fairly middle class and "made it" looking back at the poor as someone holding them back in this same manner.

Re: Being poor vs. being broke

#170

Post by potato3732842 »

vorpalhex wrote: post #147
sgarland wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are Americans who have open sewage in their yards [0], because their counties are predominantly Black or Latino, and their state deprioritizes any infrastructure work. It’s structural racism. Even better, the Trump administration canceled [1] an attempt to right that wrong, citing that it was “DEI.” 0: https://www.huffpost.com/entry/sanitation-open-sewers-black-... 1: https://apnews.com/article/justice-departme…

What the Trump administration canceled didn't right that wrong. What the Trump administration canceled was an agreement for the local county to stop issuing fines, which had already been in effect for over two years. And within those two years, the local county built zero sewers, zero hookups. They literally built nothing in two years. The original agreement under the Biden admin, which to be clear, the President doe…

I guess the DOJ saying not to fine these people is a nice gesture but in practice local fines don't mean anything in a situation like this unless the poors on the property are unlucky enough to be on a property that the municipality wants to lien and take for whatever reason.

Whatever the dollar number is, it's likely some insane punitive number (hundreds to thousands per day) that nobody could ever pay and never will actually be enforced, it's basically just a threat and you wind up going to court over it in the end or you fix it and they drop it or fine you a reasonable amount (thank the 8th amendment).

This sounds like a standoff situation. Municipality wants trailer park to pay for its own sewer. Trailer park can't afford it. Municipality fines them. Trailer park gives them the bird because they're so poor they're basically judgement proof. Municipality doesn't push the issue because if they take it and kick them all out then they will pick up the tab for remediating, etc, etc.

Post reply on HN