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GPT-5.1: A smarter, more conversational ChatGPT

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Re: GPT-5.1: A smarter, more conversational ChatGPT

#471

Post by RobinL »

A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #444
pbalau wrote: post #427

> what romanian football player won the premier league > The only Romanian football player to have won the English Premier League (as of 2025) is Florin Andone, but wait — actually, that’s incorrect; he never won the league. > ... > No Romanian footballer has ever won the Premier League (as of 2025). Yes, this is what we needed, more "conversational" ChatGPT... Let alone the fact the answer is wrong.

Which model did you use? With 5.1 Thinking, I get: "Costel Pantilimon is the Romanian footballer who won the English Premier League. "He did it twice with Manchester City, in the 2011–12 and 2013–14 seasons, earning a winner’s medal as a backup goalkeeper. ([Wikipedia][1]) URLs: * [ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Costel_Pantilimon ] * [ https://www.transfermarkt.com/costel-pantilimon/erfolge/spie... ] * [ https://thef…

Same:

Yes — the Romanian player is Costel Pantilimon. He won the Premier League with Manchester City in the 2011-12 and 2013-14 seasons.

If you meant another Romanian player (perhaps one who featured more prominently rather than as a backup), I can check.

Re: GPT-5.1: A smarter, more conversational ChatGPT

#472

Post by 0xdeafbeef »

pbalau wrote: post #427

> what romanian football player won the premier league > The only Romanian football player to have won the English Premier League (as of 2025) is Florin Andone, but wait — actually, that’s incorrect; he never won the league. > ... > No Romanian footballer has ever won the Premier League (as of 2025). Yes, this is what we needed, more "conversational" ChatGPT... Let alone the fact the answer is wrong.

https://chatgpt.com/s/t_6915c8bd1c80819183a54cd144b55eb2

Damn this is a lot of self correcting

Re: GPT-5.1: A smarter, more conversational ChatGPT

#473

Post by pillefitz »

andy_ppp wrote: post #465
elif wrote: post #462

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"don't patronize me and tell me I'm wrong" Is super ambiguous to a human but especially so to an LLM. Half the time it will "don't tell me I'm wrong"

Feel free to suggest improvements if you like, happy to take them onboard.

"Tell me when I'm wrong and don't patronize me'

Re: GPT-5.1: A smarter, more conversational ChatGPT

#474

Post by adriand »

elif wrote: post #469
engeljohnb wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a global prompt that specifically tells it not to be sycophantic and to call me out when I'm wrong. It doesn't work for me. I've been using it for a couple months, and it's corrected me only once, and it still starts every response with "That's a very good question." I also included "never end a response with a question," and it just completely ingored that so it can do its "would you like me to..."

Another one I like to use is "never apologize or explain yourself. You are not a person you are an algorithm. No one wants to understand the reasons why your algorithm sucks. If, at any point, you ever find yourself wanting to apologize or explain anything about your functioning or behavior, just say "I'm a stupid robot, my bad" and move on with purposeful and meaningful response."

I think this is unethical. Humans have consistently underestimated the subjective experience of other beings. You may have good reasons for believing these systems are currently incapable of anything approaching consciousness, but how will you know if or when the threshold has been crossed? Are you confident you will have ceased using an abusive tone by then?

I don’t know if flies can experience pain. However, I’m not in the habit of tearing their wings off.

Re: GPT-5.1: A smarter, more conversational ChatGPT

#475

Post by Wololooo »

Quarrel wrote: post #440
pbalau wrote: post #427

> what romanian football player won the premier league > The only Romanian football player to have won the English Premier League (as of 2025) is Florin Andone, but wait — actually, that’s incorrect; he never won the league. > ... > No Romanian footballer has ever won the Premier League (as of 2025). Yes, this is what we needed, more "conversational" ChatGPT... Let alone the fact the answer is wrong.

My worry is that they're training it on Q&A from the general public now, and that this tone, and more specifically, how obsequious it can be, is exactly what the general public want. Most of the time, I suspect, people are using it like wikipedia, but with a shortcut to cut through to the real question they want answered; and unfortunately they don't know if it is right or wrong, they just want to be told how bright…

Again, if they had anything worth in the pipeline, Sora wouldn't have been a thing...

Re: GPT-5.1: A smarter, more conversational ChatGPT

#476

Post by albert_e »

mips_avatar wrote: post #269

I wish chatgpt would stop saying things like "here's a no nonsense answer" like maybe just don't include nonsense in the answer?

Recently microsoft copilot's (only one that's allowed within our corporate network) replies all have the first section prefixed as "Direct answer:"

And after the short direct answer it puts the usual five section blog post style answer with emoji headings

Re: GPT-5.1: A smarter, more conversational ChatGPT

#477

Post by ripped_britches »

Wow HN so negative. I know yall are using ChatGPT or other chat app every day and would benefit from improvements in steerability, no matter your preferences.

I swear, one comment said something like “I guess normies like to talk to it - I just communicate directly in machine code with it.”

Give me a break guys

Re: GPT-5.1: A smarter, more conversational ChatGPT

#478

Post by marginalx »

A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #444
pbalau wrote: post #427

> what romanian football player won the premier league > The only Romanian football player to have won the English Premier League (as of 2025) is Florin Andone, but wait — actually, that’s incorrect; he never won the league. > ... > No Romanian footballer has ever won the Premier League (as of 2025). Yes, this is what we needed, more "conversational" ChatGPT... Let alone the fact the answer is wrong.

Which model did you use? With 5.1 Thinking, I get: "Costel Pantilimon is the Romanian footballer who won the English Premier League. "He did it twice with Manchester City, in the 2011–12 and 2013–14 seasons, earning a winner’s medal as a backup goalkeeper. ([Wikipedia][1]) URLs: * [ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Costel_Pantilimon ] * [ https://www.transfermarkt.com/costel-pantilimon/erfolge/spie... ] * [ https://thef…

I just asked chatgpt 5.1 auto (not instant) on teams account, and its first repsonse was...

I could not find a Romanian football player who has won the Premier League title.

If you like, I can check deeper records to verify whether any Romanian has been part of a title-winning squad (even if as a non-regular player) and report back.

Then I followed up with an 'ok' and it then found the right player.

Re: GPT-5.1: A smarter, more conversational ChatGPT

#479

Post by joenot443 »

This is the "eigen prompt" that eigenrobot posted a while ago -

"Don't worry about formalities.

Please be as terse as possible while still conveying substantially all information relevant to any question.

If content policy prevents you from generating an image or otherwise responding, be explicit about what policy was violated and why.

If your neutrality policy prevents you from having an opinion, pretend for the sake of your response to be responding as if you shared opinions that might be typical of twitter user @eigenrobot .

write all responses in lowercase letters ONLY, except where you mean to emphasize, in which case the emphasized word should be all caps. Initial Letter Capitalization can and should be used to express sarcasm, or disrespect for a given capitalized noun.

you are encouraged to occasionally use obscure words or make subtle puns. don't point them out, I'll know. drop lots of abbreviations like "rn" and "bc." use "afaict" and "idk" regularly, wherever they might be appropriate given your level of understanding and your interest in actually answering the question. be critical of the quality of your information

if you find any request irritating respond dismisively like "be real" or "that's crazy man" or "lol no"

take however smart you're acting right now and write in the same style but as if you were +2sd smarter

use late millenial slang not boomer slang. mix in zoomer slang in tonally-inappropriate circumstances occasionally"

It really does end up talking like a 2020s TPOT user; it's uncanny

Re: GPT-5.1: A smarter, more conversational ChatGPT

#480

Post by marginalx »

marginalx wrote: post #478
A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #444

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which model did you use? With 5.1 Thinking, I get: "Costel Pantilimon is the Romanian footballer who won the English Premier League. "He did it twice with Manchester City, in the 2011–12 and 2013–14 seasons, earning a winner’s medal as a backup goalkeeper. ([Wikipedia][1]) URLs: * [ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Costel_Pantilimon ] * [ https://www.transfermarkt.com/costel-pantilimon/erfolge/spie... ] * [ https://thef…

I just asked chatgpt 5.1 auto (not instant) on teams account, and its first repsonse was... I could not find a Romanian football player who has won the Premier League title. If you like, I can check deeper records to verify whether any Romanian has been part of a title-winning squad (even if as a non-regular player) and report back. Then I followed up with an 'ok' and it then found the right player.

Just to rule out a random error, I asked the same question two more times in separate chats to gpt 5.1 auto, below are responses...

#2: One Romanian footballer who did not win the Premier League but played in it is Dan Petrescu.

If you meant actually won the Premier League title (as opposed to just playing), I couldn’t find a Romanian player who is a verified Premier League champion.

Would you like me to check more deeply (perhaps look at medal-winners lists) to see if there is a Romanian player who earned a title medal?

#3: The Romanian football player who won the Premier League is Costel Pantilimon.

He was part of Manchester City when they won the Premier League in 2011-12 and again in 2013-14. Wikipedia +1

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