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My dad could still be alive, but he's not

jenn.site

21–30 of 328 posts

Re: My dad could still be alive, but he's not

#21

I’ve been reading Influence by Robert Cialdini and just finished a disturbing section about how we are wired to obey an authority figure even when it causes harm. In this instance, the 911 dispatcher was the authority figure. Sad story.

In such cases how do you in advance what causes harm? Waiting for the ambulance or driving yourself? People died also because they didn’t wait for an ambulance.

Re: My dad could still be alive, but he's not

#22
post #9
post #2

This story reminds me of how the high schoolers on the Korean ferry MV Sewol obeyed the instructions to stay in their rooms.

I don't have this one in my memory but... high schoolers? I'm not going to look that up.

There are a few docs out there on it, extremely extremely extremely insane/sad situation. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_A8dq2fA5o

Re: My dad could still be alive, but he's not

#23
post #5

>my dad is dead, because his family members were too naive to know that the thing they were instructed to do by the state was a false thing. We're told a lot of things by "officials" not because it's correct, but because it holds the least legal liability for official parties involved, especially anything involving healthcare. These officials also sometimes include doctors, who work to protect themselves and the syst…

This is very conspiratorial thinking.

Do you really think that in a high stress situation you’re going to make the best decisions?

Do you really think health workers are all concerned about legalities first?

Not moving a patient unless you explicitly know how is probably right the vast majority of the time. Sometimes that’s wrong, but how are you going to get the entire public to understand what the right situation is?

It’s so easy looking at a single case in hindsight. May we all have the ability to make the right choices all the time.

Re: My dad could still be alive, but he's not

#24
post #20

I’ve been reading Influence by Robert Cialdini and just finished a disturbing section about how we are wired to obey an authority figure even when it causes harm. In this instance, the 911 dispatcher was the authority figure. Sad story.

See also the Milgram Experiment.

Doesn’t fit here because you don’t know if obeying or ignoring causes the harm.

Re: My dad could still be alive, but he's not

#25

>family members were too naive to know that the thing they were instructed to do by the state was a false thing Would be interesting to see everyone who jumped in here yesterday [1] to comment on this one as well. 1: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45889297

What terrifies me personally is that people with 2-digit IQs are apparently being employed in virology labs. That's the kind of realization that could undermine anyone's confidence in government.

Re: My dad could still be alive, but he's not

#26
post #5

>my dad is dead, because his family members were too naive to know that the thing they were instructed to do by the state was a false thing. We're told a lot of things by "officials" not because it's correct, but because it holds the least legal liability for official parties involved, especially anything involving healthcare. These officials also sometimes include doctors, who work to protect themselves and the syst…

Incompetence and laziness among doctors is a big cause. As a professional you've probably worked with many colleagues you thought were bad. Well there are doctors like that too. Many of them. And unlike in tech, they don't get let go if they're bad. They stay around and keep "treating" patients.

Re: My dad could still be alive, but he's not

#28
There's another scenario where someone heads to the hospital and get stuck at a red light or behind and accident or you're speeding and kill someone. It's just hard to know sometimes which path to pick when you don't have a guaranteed outcome on either one.

In any case, I'm sorry for your loss. My dad died too due to a heart attack, except he was alone.

Re: My dad could still be alive, but he's not

#29
post #15
post #5

>my dad is dead, because his family members were too naive to know that the thing they were instructed to do by the state was a false thing. We're told a lot of things by "officials" not because it's correct, but because it holds the least legal liability for official parties involved, especially anything involving healthcare. These officials also sometimes include doctors, who work to protect themselves and the syst…

We're also told to do a lot of things by officials because it's correct most of the time, but with the benefit of 20/20 hindsight, generally correct advice can turn out to be dead wrong for you. Sometimes doing what you're told is the right thing. Sometimes, not doing what you're told is the right thing. Sometimes, you're told to do the intuitive thing, and it's wrong. Sometimes, you're told to do the unintuitive thi…

Perhaps 2020 hindsight, even.

Re: My dad could still be alive, but he's not

#30
post #5

>my dad is dead, because his family members were too naive to know that the thing they were instructed to do by the state was a false thing. We're told a lot of things by "officials" not because it's correct, but because it holds the least legal liability for official parties involved, especially anything involving healthcare. These officials also sometimes include doctors, who work to protect themselves and the syst…

Incompetence and laziness among doctors is a big cause. As a professional you've probably worked with many colleagues you thought were bad. Well there are doctors like that too. Many of them. And unlike in tech, they don't get let go if they're bad. They stay around and keep "treating" patients.

I was thinking this the other day about GP. If I work in tech I work in a team and we pair. Why doesnt this happen with doctors. Why is everything all on one mind to get wrong or right. Yes there is a team of doctors sometimes but they communicate via emails async and you visit one then the next and so on. I guess I know the answer. Money.
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