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Largest cargo sailboat completes first Atlantic crossing

marineinsight.com

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Re: Largest cargo sailboat completes first Atlantic crossing

#11

Post by defrost »

tengwar2 wrote: post #10
defrost wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a dim recollection of exactly this as a VC proposal likely put to YC in the past 24 months or so. I think the notion was to fit masts to existing container ship and stacks, and I gsve it scant attention as my intuition (I once studied actual civil/mech engineering prior to jumping ship for applied math) suggested masts are better as integral parts of ships rather than bolt on after thoughts. EDIT: Wingsails to…

This is an area I have some peripheral involvement with. For retrofitted sails on bulkers, the figure of 10% saving in fuel is the usual one mentioned rather than 20%. However given the long life of ships, there is much more interest in retrofit than in new build. You mention container ships. I haven't seen anything explicit on these, and I think the reason is probably that they cruise much faster than bulkers and ta…

Retro fit is clearly a preferred path for a new approach given ship life spans and size of existing global transport fleet.

My gut objection to the container approach taken above in the first link was existing container locking mechanisms for ships can struggle in severe weather to keep the boxes on the boat .. additional forces from a sail (in good weather) might well mimic the forces that break stacks in bad weather.

Your point is well taken, I might suggest that container ships could be segregated into fast and slow cargo and that might help somewhat with total fleet fuel consumption. (pure spitball notion).

Re: Largest cargo sailboat completes first Atlantic crossing

#14

Post by jacquesm »

Aurornis wrote: post #6
aerostable_slug wrote: post #2

> The 136-metre-long vessel had to rely partly on its auxiliary motor and its remaining sail after the aft sail was damaged in a storm shortly after departure. Well, that's a bummer. That said, this does seem the way of the future. We just need to either figure out maintenance robots and/or find a way to keep human crew happy on long, slow voyages across the Pacific.

> or find a way to keep human crew happy on long, slow voyages across the Pacific. The few people I know who pursued jobs on boats did so because they liked being out at sea, away from land. Combine that with the modern availability of high speed internet via Starlink and entertainment is not a problem.

> The few people I know who pursued jobs on boats did so because they liked being out at sea, away from land.

Maybe it wasn't just the land they were getting away from.

Re: Largest cargo sailboat completes first Atlantic crossing

#15

Post by jacquesm »

nradov wrote: post #9
aerostable_slug wrote: post #2

> The 136-metre-long vessel had to rely partly on its auxiliary motor and its remaining sail after the aft sail was damaged in a storm shortly after departure. Well, that's a bummer. That said, this does seem the way of the future. We just need to either figure out maintenance robots and/or find a way to keep human crew happy on long, slow voyages across the Pacific.

You've got to be kidding. Using a fully sail powered cargo vessel is a PR stunt, not the way of the future. Regular motorized cargo vessels will probably use some form of sails to slightly reduce fuel burn on downwind legs but it's physically impossible to move huge volumes of cargo purely by sail power in an economical way. There just isn't enough energy in the wind.

That's both wrong and right at the same time. There is plenty of energy in the wind, but when it isn't blowing in a favorable direction for your journey it will cause you to have to considerably lengthen your trip or end up in places where you don't want to go. It also isn't as constant and/or reliable as a motor. But until a few hundred years ago wind was all we had, and there is no reason why you could not make a containership that is wind powered just like it used to be. It's going to be interesting to see what kind of hull that would be. When the wind is blowing, favorable direction or not and it exceeds your expectations you're going to find out that there is more energy in the wind than you are prepared to deal with. If you've ever been on a sailboat in a storm that is the last thing you would write.

Re: Largest cargo sailboat completes first Atlantic crossing

#17

Post by HardwareLust »

Aurornis wrote: post #6
aerostable_slug wrote: post #2

> The 136-metre-long vessel had to rely partly on its auxiliary motor and its remaining sail after the aft sail was damaged in a storm shortly after departure. Well, that's a bummer. That said, this does seem the way of the future. We just need to either figure out maintenance robots and/or find a way to keep human crew happy on long, slow voyages across the Pacific.

> or find a way to keep human crew happy on long, slow voyages across the Pacific. The few people I know who pursued jobs on boats did so because they liked being out at sea, away from land. Combine that with the modern availability of high speed internet via Starlink and entertainment is not a problem.

Spent 13 years at sea, loved every minute. I actually liked it better before phones and Internet came onboard.

Re: Largest cargo sailboat completes first Atlantic crossing

#18

Post by HardwareLust »

ForHackernews wrote: post #13

There are even more crazy steampunk ideas out there, like pulling ships with giant high-altitude kites https://interestingengineering.com/innovation/giant-kite-sai...

Cool link, thanks! Unfortunately they went bankrupt and the tech now belongs to what was their first and only customer, K Line.

Re: Largest cargo sailboat completes first Atlantic crossing

#20

Post by _yb2s »

nradov wrote: post #9
aerostable_slug wrote: post #2

> The 136-metre-long vessel had to rely partly on its auxiliary motor and its remaining sail after the aft sail was damaged in a storm shortly after departure. Well, that's a bummer. That said, this does seem the way of the future. We just need to either figure out maintenance robots and/or find a way to keep human crew happy on long, slow voyages across the Pacific.

You've got to be kidding. Using a fully sail powered cargo vessel is a PR stunt, not the way of the future. Regular motorized cargo vessels will probably use some form of sails to slightly reduce fuel burn on downwind legs but it's physically impossible to move huge volumes of cargo purely by sail power in an economical way. There just isn't enough energy in the wind.

There’s more than enough energy in the wind, and modern sailing technology has come a long ways. Some modern recreational sailboats can cross an ocean as fast as a cargo ship on just wind power, and speed isn’t even much of a factor for a lot of shipping. With the right tech I think fuel free shipping can disrupt fossil fuel shipping just by being cheaper.

Back when engines first replaced sailing fuel was nearly free, and sailboats were incredibly slow, dangerous, unreliable, and didn’t sail upwind well, and all that has changed- time to take another look.

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