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Europeans recognize Zohran Mamdani's policies as 'normal'

theguardian.com

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Re: Europeans recognize Zohran Mamdani's policies as 'normal'

#21

Post by toomuchtodo »

afavour wrote: post #15
ryandrake wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Based on some of the hysterical commenters yesterday, you'd think that Lenin himself is moving into the mayor's office. People's sense of scale and the Overton window are so wacky right now.

As a New Yorker it’s been exhausting. So many ill-informed takes, like “he wants rent control!!”, ignorant of the fact that NYC already has rent control and has in some form or another since WW2.

It turns out that wide swaths of the electorate are some combination of ignorant, uneducated, and low functioning with a tad of fear thrown in. It’s unfortunate.

Kentucky voters were wondering why polls weren’t open Tuesday to vote in these elections, for example, so someone being wildly misinformed about policy proposals or their mechanics would come as no surprise.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/articles/kentucky-politician-had-...

https://x.com/KYSecState/status/1985734353515671601

> We’re getting calls about polls being closed. They are closed because we do not have elections today. Kentucky votes next year. You cannot vote today in Kentucky for the mayor of New York City or the Governor of Virginia. Sorry. — Michael Adams, KY Secretary of State

Re: Europeans recognize Zohran Mamdani's policies as 'normal'

#22

Post by mytailorisrich »

afavour wrote: post #3
mytailorisrich wrote: post #2

The Guardian strikes again... as an European those policies are not " a given "... shockingly, we need to buy tickets to ride the bus, childcare is not usually free overall, and rent freezes don't work. It is also not so normal to claim to be a bona fide socialist (and Europe knows more than most what this means).

I think you can nitpick the detail but the broader point is still true. Yes, you still pay for the bus, but it’s heavily subsidised. Yes, you still pay for childcare but government subsidies make it wildly more affordable than it is today for New Yorkers. The general pitch is “raise taxes to make life more affordable for all”. That’s an idea Europeans can identify with.

I think a big issue some Americans have is that they think socialism is great because it is the European model.

1. Europe is not socialist (Eastern Europe and the USSR were). And, no, social-democracy is NOT socialism.

2. The welfare state is essentially bankrupt in many European countries.

3. Socialism cannot, ultimately be democratic.

My only sane interpretation for an election of a socialist candidate in 2025 is that this is a protest vote not an adhesion to socialism...

Re: Europeans recognize Zohran Mamdani's policies as 'normal'

#23

Post by afavour »

dekken_ wrote: post #16
afavour wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don’t think it’s absurdly simplistic to say “taxes = revolution”? It’s not like Mamdani snuck into power. Voters chose him specifically on the agenda he proposed. Why would they revolt?

If you have no say in how much you are taxed, that is taxation without representation. Seems you completely missed the point.

> If you have no say in how much you are taxed

Which New Yorkers do, because they just voted.

I guess I did miss the point because from where I’m standing this is all a big non sequitur.

“Mamdani seeks to raise taxes and spend the revenue on subsidizing services used by all. This is similar to an approach seen often in Europe”

“Did you know that if you tax people too much they revolt”

…okay?

Re: Europeans recognize Zohran Mamdani's policies as 'normal'

#26

Post by SequoiaHope »

mytailorisrich wrote: post #2

The Guardian strikes again... as an European those policies are not " a given "... shockingly, we need to buy tickets to ride the bus, childcare is not usually free overall, and rent freezes don't work. It is also not so normal to claim to be a bona fide socialist (and Europe knows more than most what this means).

It seems like quite a few European countries have a social-democratic party which seems broadly similar to the idea of democratic socialism, which I think I recall is what Mamdani identified with in his acceptance speech.

Re: Europeans recognize Zohran Mamdani's policies as 'normal'

#27

Post by ZeroGravitas »

afavour wrote: post #15
ryandrake wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Based on some of the hysterical commenters yesterday, you'd think that Lenin himself is moving into the mayor's office. People's sense of scale and the Overton window are so wacky right now.

As a New Yorker it’s been exhausting. So many ill-informed takes, like “he wants rent control!!”, ignorant of the fact that NYC already has rent control and has in some form or another since WW2.

NYC also ran a free bus pilot program recently:

https://www.mta.info/guides/riding-the-bus/fare-free-bus-pil...

> From September 24, 2023 to August 31, 2024, five MTA bus routes — Bx18A/B, B60, M116, Q4, and S46/96 — were fare-free. Passengers on these routes were able to ride without paying the fare.

> The purpose of the pilot was to study how fare-free service affects ridership, access, equity, and fare evasion. It was made possible thanks to funding from the New York State FY2024 budge

Re: Europeans recognize Zohran Mamdani's policies as 'normal'

#29

Post by UltraSane »

newyankee wrote: post #4

Have most Western countries mostly given up on supply side policies for housing price stablisation as an option ? Odd given how much construction tech has improved.

We could build strong, very energy efficient houses incredibly fast using Structural Insulated Panels.

Re: Europeans recognize Zohran Mamdani's policies as 'normal'

#30

Post by dekken_ »

afavour wrote: post #23
dekken_ wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you have no say in how much you are taxed, that is taxation without representation. Seems you completely missed the point.

> If you have no say in how much you are taxed Which New Yorkers do, because they just voted. I guess I did miss the point because from where I’m standing this is all a big non sequitur. “Mamdani seeks to raise taxes and spend the revenue on subsidizing services used by all. This is similar to an approach seen often in Europe” “Did you know that if you tax people too much they revolt” …okay?

I realize this is difficult for you, but if you read my first response to you, it was talking about Europeans (which I am), and what they identify with, we as Europeans, have little say in how we are taxed.
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