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IKEA launches new smart home range with 21 Matter-compatible products

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Re: IKEA launches new smart home range with 21 Matter-compatible products

#151

Post by Ajedi32 »

nagisa wrote: post #129
Ajedi32 wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I realize Thread devices need a border router, but once they're connected to that router don't they get an IPv6 address with internet access? Or am I just misunderstanding the protocol?

A border router is not necessary in a typical installation! Its something you only need if you want to do fancy things. Otherwise a commissioner is sufficient (to bring the device onto the network.) That said, it is entirely up to you how you would configure the system that the thread border router connects to. Thread specification uses local addresses for the thread devices, so in order for these devices to get acce…

Almost all real-world Thread networks I'm aware of have a border router in the form of an Apple TV, Nest Hub, Amazon Echo, etc, so I'm not particularly reassured by the fact that the protocol doesn't technically require one.

I was under the impression IPv6 doesn't need NAT. But you're saying they only get unique local addresses, so even with a border router bridging the connection back to my local Wi-Fi network they still can't send packets out to the internet? "They would have to ask DHCP for a real IP first" doesn't seem like much of a barrier.

Re: IKEA launches new smart home range with 21 Matter-compatible products

#152

Post by uplifter »

lynndotpy wrote: post #144

Coming as a very disgruntled and burned Philips Hue owner. Only four bulbs, but Philips is a name which leaves behind bile when spoken. Ikea's Tradfri line was very refreshing for being entirely configurable with the wireless remote it comes with. You can connect multiple bulbs to one remote, without ever tinkering with an app or a hub or Home Assistant, etc. Crucially, old TRADFRI communicated from the remote contro…

I'm curious why you are disgruntled with Philips Hue. They were quite honestly one of my happiest purchases, though I bought them when they were the only programmable color lights available to buy and I would probably get another model today.

Was it the dropping of support?

Re: IKEA launches new smart home range with 21 Matter-compatible products

#153

Post by kps »

cameldrv wrote: post #136

I really like the idea of an open, local standard for this stuff. I have been a little annoyed at the matter standards immaturity still. Two things I’ve noticed is that there’s not good support for very low power devices that use WiFi. What you’d like to do, for example for a battery powered sensor, is to go into deep sleep and disconnect from the WiFi and then wake up periodically and report the sensor reading. Unfo…

>there’s not good support for very low power devices that use WiFi

That's what Thread is for.

Re: IKEA launches new smart home range with 21 Matter-compatible products

#154

Post by niceguy1827 »

cameldrv wrote: post #136

I really like the idea of an open, local standard for this stuff. I have been a little annoyed at the matter standards immaturity still. Two things I’ve noticed is that there’s not good support for very low power devices that use WiFi. What you’d like to do, for example for a battery powered sensor, is to go into deep sleep and disconnect from the WiFi and then wake up periodically and report the sensor reading. Unfo…

I've seen somebody on Reddit using LoRa stuff for the home.

The problem with these wifi based sensors is that you eventually run out of IP addresses (yes you could get fancy with subnet setup but still). Another problem is that at some point you might want to swap routers -- I had to swap out a faulty Netgear router, and the re-set was a major PITA. For these reasons I've been moving to Zigbee.

Re: IKEA launches new smart home range with 21 Matter-compatible products

#155

Post by kiney »

mongol wrote: post #42

Will zigbee2mqtt be able to talk to these? Or are they in a fully different type of network? If not, any other software that can do MQTT bridging with these?

sadly not, and afaik they don't plan on adding matter support. Thats a big reason I'll stick with zigbee for now.

Re: IKEA launches new smart home range with 21 Matter-compatible products

#156

Post by kraftman »

jonplackett wrote: post #117
rkomorn wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An induction stove doesn't answer your monitoring needs, but it's probably the safest thing to cook with. Only heats up when there's a pan, not prone to fires, ours even complains loudly if something unexpected is happening (eg lots of spilled liquid).

Every induction stove I’ve ever used though, was designed by someone who either has never heard of human interface design, or has done and entirely hates the concept of it. Eg, buttons so close to the heating element that they hurt to press Buttons to turn it off that only work when dry, places near where a spill would go. Buttons you have to press up to 10 times just to get it to a reasonable heat. Why does inductio…

I spent a year in a bunch of airbnbs and every time there was an induction hob it had at least one of these issues. I really like them otherwise but the buttons are just so bad.

Re: IKEA launches new smart home range with 21 Matter-compatible products

#157

Post by gregmac »

cameldrv wrote: post #136

I really like the idea of an open, local standard for this stuff. I have been a little annoyed at the matter standards immaturity still. Two things I’ve noticed is that there’s not good support for very low power devices that use WiFi. What you’d like to do, for example for a battery powered sensor, is to go into deep sleep and disconnect from the WiFi and then wake up periodically and report the sensor reading. Unfo…

> there’s not good support for very low power devices that use WiFi

That's why we have Thread. Wifi just isn't a very efficient protocol for using with deep sleep. The radio takes more power to run, the overhead of connecting is higher, and the device needs a full IP stack. Even with power save mode (if supported by client and AP), the radio is on for hundreds of milliseconds to send a message.

Thread has "sleepy end device" profile built-in where the hub will queue messages and expects the device to be in deep sleep most of the time. And since it doesn't have so much overhead, the radio only has to be on for tens of milliseconds.

Re: IKEA launches new smart home range with 21 Matter-compatible products

#158

Post by FireBeyond »

moshib wrote: post #3

IKEA's Zigbee devices have been some of the more stable smart devices I owned. I wasn't running their hub, opting to run with deCONZ in the past and moving to Zigbee2MQTT in recent years. I do wish the new range would include blinds; the previous generation (FYRTUR) is out of production, and it doesn't seem like there's a replacement yet.

Yeah, I have a Dirigera hub, motion sensors and lights running pretty stably. I connect them into HomeKit via HomeBridge and it's been solid.

I was also somewhat impressed, and happy, that the Dirigera supported the older (I think discontinued now) Tradfri devices rather than making you replace things.

Re: IKEA launches new smart home range with 21 Matter-compatible products

#159

Post by gregmac »

niceguy1827 wrote: post #154
cameldrv wrote: post #136

I really like the idea of an open, local standard for this stuff. I have been a little annoyed at the matter standards immaturity still. Two things I’ve noticed is that there’s not good support for very low power devices that use WiFi. What you’d like to do, for example for a battery powered sensor, is to go into deep sleep and disconnect from the WiFi and then wake up periodically and report the sensor reading. Unfo…

I've seen somebody on Reddit using LoRa stuff for the home. The problem with these wifi based sensors is that you eventually run out of IP addresses (yes you could get fancy with subnet setup but still). Another problem is that at some point you might want to swap routers -- I had to swap out a faulty Netgear router, and the re-set was a major PITA. For these reasons I've been moving to Zigbee.

It's good to move to Zigbee/thread/z-wave anyway because they're all better protocols for smarthome stuff. Plus wifi means you might be buying stuff that relies on cloud, which is a non-starter for anyone that doesn't like buying future paperweights.

But your criticisms are strange. You have more than 254 devices connecting (which implies a complex setup) but can't increase the subnet size? Or does your router just have an absurdly small default DHCP range?

I also don't understand the swap your router problem, unless you're also using default SSIDs and not changing it. Configure the SSID and PSK to be the same as before and everything will just work.

Re: IKEA launches new smart home range with 21 Matter-compatible products

#160

Post by lynndotpy »

uplifter wrote: post #152
lynndotpy wrote: post #144

Coming as a very disgruntled and burned Philips Hue owner. Only four bulbs, but Philips is a name which leaves behind bile when spoken. Ikea's Tradfri line was very refreshing for being entirely configurable with the wireless remote it comes with. You can connect multiple bulbs to one remote, without ever tinkering with an app or a hub or Home Assistant, etc. Crucially, old TRADFRI communicated from the remote contro…

I'm curious why you are disgruntled with Philips Hue. They were quite honestly one of my happiest purchases, though I bought them when they were the only programmable color lights available to buy and I would probably get another model today. Was it the dropping of support?

They started requiring an account to use the lights, and support started stating stating that the bulbs will not be usable without an account or the app, with the CTO stating intention to deprecate the local APIs entirely. This flies in the face of why I bought Hue. These are woes I thought I'd be "safe" from when I bought from Philips. I never wanted to create an account or use an app.

After spending time setting up Home Assistant, figuring out what I'd need to do to prevent a firmware update from hitting the bulbs, etc. I decided just to chalk the bulbs up to trash and sell them.

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