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Why aren't smart people happier?

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Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#161

Post by aleph_minus_one »

> Google “smartest people in the world” and most of the results will be physicists, mathematicians, computer scientists, and chess masters.

Clearly not chess masters.

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> poorly defined problems [are also] everyday questions like [...] “how do you figure out what to do today.”

I think that I do have a sensible answer to this question, but the problem rather is that my answer is very different from what I am obliged by society to do. I can easily believe that a less intelligent person would not immediately see this discrepancy, and thus be happier.

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Concerning

> Christopher Langan, a guy who can score eye-popping numbers on IQ tests, believes that 9/11 was an inside job

and

> they’re still unable to solve basic but poorly defined problems like “maintain a basic grip on reality”

Being intelligent does not mean that that you have the same "trust anchor of truth" as many other people in society have, even if you assume that they are perfectly rationally thinking people (and I personally believe that being very smart and being a rationalist are only loosely correlated (you must be somewhat smart to be a rationalist, but the other direction (smart people are very rationalist) in my experience does not hold)).

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#162

Post by imgabe »

"happy" seems like a temporary state. It's a reaction you have to an event. In base state without any input, you would be neither happy nor unhappy. Then something happens and if you like it you're happy about it for a while and if you don't like it you're unhappy about it for a while and then you go back to being neutral. It seems like the wrong question to ask to expect people to just walk around "happy" 24/7 for no reason.

Questions like this are basically just noise. If you ask someone whether they are happy with their life overall, it will depend on whatever most recently happened and how they feel about it. Being smart doesn't mean nothing unhappy is ever going to happen to you. You'll still fail at something, pets and loved ones will die, you'll get laid off or whatever.

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#163

Post by mac3n »

mac3n wrote: post #156

> I have never been one of those who cares about happiness. Happiness is a strange notion. I am just not made for it. It has never been a goal of mine; I do not think in those terms. < Werner Herzog

also "Happy People: A Year in the Taiga", film by Werner Herzog

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#164

Post by RealityVoid »

I only read the intro, and I don't think I can bare the rest of it. First, I think the premises is false. I think smarter people are happyer. Second, many people when they engage with pieces like this, expect that smarter people are unhappyer, which, yes, the article doesn't say this, but I feel it at least suggests it.

And last but not least, their study that says smart people are not happier doesn't really say that. It essentially says smart people are happier when not surrounded by stupid people.

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#165

Post by cortesoft »

zdragnar wrote: post #84
Ardon wrote: post #53

Might be useful to ask a different question: What makes people happy? It's things like relationships, satisfying work, accomplishment. (and many, many more) Then the real question emerges: How many of those happiness 'sources' are made better by intelligence? What percentage? Relationships? Seems like no. Work? Also seems like no, lots of work doesn't make use of a high IQ that people enjoy nonetheless. Accomplishmen…

As I heard someone say, happiness is your reality minus your expectations. Smart people see more variables that could be changed, more components that could be modified, and are less likely to accept things as they are. This creates a false sense of ease by which reality could be modified, and thus higher expectations for the world around them. I suspect this misplaces happiness and contentment, but the two are also…

There was a movie a while back that talked about what makes people happy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Happy_(2011_film)

It had some interesting ideas, and one of the things that stuck with me is the idea of your brain being a "difference engine" in that the variation is what matters. If we don't experience pain, we can't experience pleasure.

It seems a bit simplistic when stated that way, but I think there is something to it.

Another thing I have come to believe as I have aged is that our western (American especially) society places too much emphasis on happiness, in that we think happiness is (and should be) the prime goal of every human. I have come to believe that less and less, and think something like satisfaction, contentment, and purpose are much more important as life goals than happiness. Happiness is an important part of life, and is important for reaching the other goals I mentioned, but it is not the end goal (to me). I think most of us somewhat intuitively understand this, although our response is often to redefine what happiness is rather than concluding happiness isn't our end goal.

If happiness was everything, we would be much more accepting and encouraging towards hedonism than we are. A heroin addict who has a good clean supply and no responsibilities would be the ultimate dream life if we truly believed pure happiness was the most important thing.

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#166

Post by aleph_minus_one »

impossiblefork wrote: post #104
badpun wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sportsmen compete in imaginary competitions with equally physially gifted people just to win a prize. And yet, many are fulfilled by it. For some people, competing is what drives them.

Yes, but then you know it's a game, so there's no self-deception that you're actually doing something meaningful. This realization thus gives the whole sportsmanship concept.

> Yes, but then you know it's a game, so there's no self-deception that you're actually doing something meaningful.

I have reasons to believe that many very successful athletes do have this self-deception.

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#167

Post by Telaneo »

AaronAPU wrote: post #137
wouldbecouldbe wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s really not fixed; you can easily train your mind to be less neurotic and more joyful

It really is wild the degree to which you can simply dictate your own mood. If I catch myself feeling grumpy or down, it is pretty easy to reframe and summon genuine happiness. Even during intense suffering of various kinds. To a large extent you get to decide which universe you live in.

> It really is wild the degree to which you can simply dictate your own mood.

This is not a universally true experience, and it's sometimes even hard for me to believe that there are people like you out there who are able to change their mood just by thinking differently. My own experience is that doing that is about as helpful as thinking differently about how hungry I am works to sate my hunger. I can ignore it to some extent, but it doesn't change in kind.

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#168

Post by asah »

kaicianflone wrote: post #60

This answer might upset some people, but it’s really about balance. Spiritual healing is something many intelligent people quietly need. Too often, “intellectuals” dismiss the Bible outright. Relying on arguments they half-remember from TikTok or high-school debates instead of actually reading it and forming their own conclusion, like they would with any other subject. I’m just a developer, but I think intelligence c…

lol, the majority of the world isn't remotely Christian...

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#169

Post by aleph_minus_one »

dingnuts wrote: post #70
ASalazarMX wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or, you could just ask "Why aren't people happy?". I don't see how IQ could make you happier. Smart people are not as smart as they think, they usually perform better because they're overspecialized. Now, emotional intelligence, that would greatly influece your happiness. The hurdles you're talking about are emotional, not intellectual.

usually when people talk about emotional intelligence, they mean Big 5 Agreeableness plus Openness, which can be measured. If your hypothesis is correct there should be data on the potential correlation between those traits and self reported happiness

As far as I am aware, concerning the Big 5 traits

- There is a strong positive correlation between "Openness" and IQ (some people even claim that "Openness" is actually some weak version of an IQ test)

- There is a small negative correlation between "Extraversion" and IQ

The other three Big 5 traits are basically independent of IQ.

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#170

Post by kaicianflone »

chermi wrote: post #145
kaicianflone wrote: post #60

This answer might upset some people, but it’s really about balance. Spiritual healing is something many intelligent people quietly need. Too often, “intellectuals” dismiss the Bible outright. Relying on arguments they half-remember from TikTok or high-school debates instead of actually reading it and forming their own conclusion, like they would with any other subject. I’m just a developer, but I think intelligence c…

Way to set up a false dichotomy. I agree with the "cleverness" and the pride people take in not being religious, it's silly. But there are many forms of religion/spirituality. At the end of the day, you're just pushing the Bible here, which isn't very admirable. Maybe instead you could encourage people to explore spirituality instead of a specific religion that you probably follow only because of where you were born.…

I hear you and I’m not trying to push a cultural version of Christianity. What I’m saying is that Jesus wasn’t just another spiritual teacher. He fulfilled hundreds of prophecies written centuries before His birth, and instead of conquering through power, He conquered through sacrifice. That’s what makes His message different and why His story has endured when so many philosophies fade.

Not all spirituality leads to peace. We live in an age where “spirituality” often means yoga, breathwork, or Stoic quotes. Things that calm the body but rarely heal the soul. Marcus Aurelius was wise, but even he couldn’t save himself from despair.

I think many of us, myself included, have resisted Christianity because of how poorly it’s been represented. But the real Christ isn’t a tool of culture or control. He’s the God who stepped down, fulfilled His own Word, and died in our place. That’s not pride. That’s mercy.

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