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Ask HN: Education is broken, how do you fix it?

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Re: Ask HN: Education is broken, how do you fix it?

#11
See Harvard Graduate School of Education report "Pathways to Prosperity: http://www.gse.harvard.edu/news_events/features/2011/Pathway...

Some interesting strides have been made by the Partnership for 21st Century Skills in changing how we learn and also how we measure learning success:

http://www.p21.org/

Even Apple threw its hat in the ring with Challenge Based Learning:

http://www.apple.com/education/challenge-based-learning/

Without doubt the current models being used in the US don't work. We aren't teaching the right skills, we aren't measuring skills the right way (uniform class-wide tests EOY) and the funding structure for schools encourages bureaucracy and corruption at times.

However, the problems are all tightly intertwined in one ball. I would caution against thinking that 'modern tech' is a cure all. Going from paper to iPads won't solve all of the issues in a day. That said, some really cool companies are killing it. Take a look at Edmodo.

Wish I had more time to get into this, alas, back to my code cave.

Re: Ask HN: Education is broken, how do you fix it?

#12

> how would you go about implementing this in a real life class format? Allow experienced professional educators to shape education policy.

Indeed, letting teachers decide what to do on the basis of what's rasiest and most convenient for them is bound to have a 1:1 correspondence with the best way for people to learn.

Re: Ask HN: Education is broken, how do you fix it?

#13

The high school I taught at for several years was working to lessen the usage of textbooks and primarily work with literature and primary source materials. In the history department, we delivered facts using lectures or a textbook reading. Basically, the idea was to give the students enough facts that they could then interpret and critically think about literature and the primary source materials. My testing was main…

it is also kind of silly that you need a college degree and a credential to teach elementary school. Shouldn't everyone be proficient enough at elementary school concepts when they graduate high school that they could then teach the basics to others?

This is a really important issue to understand. Good teaching is difficult, even at the elementary level. Good teaching includes: - responding to each student's learning style; - answering questions in a way that sets students up for deeper learning in later years; - meeting each student where they are at, and allowing them to progress at their own pace each year; - dealing effectively with students who come to school hungry, abused, neglected and so forth; - a host of other situations that are difficult to deal with effectively, but for which solutions have been developed.

This ties in well with one of your other observations: I also believe that teacher credentialing has backfired. Credentialing programs are basically made up of $10,000 of busywork and make it so anyone that can put up with doing busywork can get through (exceptions exist).

In my experience as a teacher, I have seen this consistently. There is one local teacher ed program where I live, and the administrators pride themselves on running a "challenging" program. It is challenging in the volume of work required, not in the intellectual effort required. There are so many bad effects of this approach, and so many potentially good effects if an intellectually rigorous and challenging program took its place.

I have also had an incredibly frustrating experience dealing with certification. I started teaching in one state, and taught there for 7 years. When I moved, I was granted temporary certification based on having held full certification in another state. I have hosted student teachers, and generally been recognized as an effective teacher. But after a few years in my new state, I was told I had to go back and do a student teaching program because the paperwork from my old state didn't fill in the right boxes on the paperwork in my new state. Utter BS, and this is exactly the kind of stuff that drives good teachers out of education.

I chose to stay in education and not let myself get pushed out by stupid bureaucratic issues. I resolved to do my part in addressing these issues, though, and I am grateful to be working with a staff that is tackling hard education issues effectively.

Re: Ask HN: Education is broken, how do you fix it?

#14

> how would you go about implementing this in a real life class format? Allow experienced professional educators to shape education policy.

Allow experienced professional educators to shape education policy.

What in particular is stopping experienced professional educators from shaping educational policy now? What are some of the policies that you expect would look different if your suggestion were implemented?

Re: Ask HN: Education is broken, how do you fix it?

#15

> how would you go about implementing this in a real life class format? Allow experienced professional educators to shape education policy.

Allow experienced professional educators to shape education policy. What in particular is stopping experienced professional educators from shaping educational policy now? What are some of the policies that you expect would look different if your suggestion were implemented?

> What in particular is stopping experienced professional educators from shaping educational policy now?

Overwork, bureaucracy, an anti-teacher and anti-intellect culture to name a few.

> What are some of the policies that you expect would look different if your suggestion were implemented?

NCLB and RTTT would be eliminated. Equity of access to schooling which facilitates critical thinking would be made a paramount goal. Long story short -- educators would try to shape our system to model Finland's philosophies.

Re: Ask HN: Education is broken, how do you fix it?

#16

> how would you go about implementing this in a real life class format? Allow experienced professional educators to shape education policy.

Indeed, letting teachers decide what to do on the basis of what's rasiest and most convenient for them is bound to have a 1:1 correspondence with the best way for people to learn.

> Indeed, letting teachers decide what to do on the basis of what's rasiest and most convenient for them is bound to have a 1:1 correspondence with the best way for people to learn.

I consider myself a professional educator, so I will treat this statement as if you were aiming it directly at me.

I'm not yet 10 years into my career, but I daresay I have a solid understanding of what facilitates effective learning among my students. I can quickly, accurately, and individually asses and guide my students on a path which best suits their needs.

There is nothing a standardized test in my subject area can tell me about my class that I don't already know, and there is much that a standardized test will not reveal about the individuals within my class that I and my colleagues already know.

I would like to see my students freed from wasting their valuable time preparing for absurd tests which do not serve them in any useful or meaningful fashion. My admins know how my students are doing because they receive reports directly from me. They know my word is good because I am a professional.

The implementation of my wish to eliminate meaningless standardized testing and have more control over my curriculum would not earn me one more cent than I currently make. (I make less than 45k / year and I'm 6 years into it with a masters degree.)

I love my work and seeing my students succeed is why I do it.

Re: Ask HN: Education is broken, how do you fix it?

#17

> how would you go about implementing this in a real life class format? Allow experienced professional educators to shape education policy.

How would you implement this? Would you eleminate all elected officials from education policy, such as local boards of education? Who would determine what qualifies as an "expereinced, proffessional educator"?

> How would you implement this?

Include experienced professional educators in on the creation and updating of NCLB, RTTT, or any policy aimed at education.

> Would you eleminate all elected officials from education policy, such as local boards of education?

No.

> Who would determine what qualifies as an "experienced, professional educator"?

Similar to what happens within the law, medical,or any other professional community -- a team of professional, accomplished people within the specific field would set the bar and determines who qualifies.

Re: Ask HN: Education is broken, how do you fix it?

#18
post #13

The high school I taught at for several years was working to lessen the usage of textbooks and primarily work with literature and primary source materials. In the history department, we delivered facts using lectures or a textbook reading. Basically, the idea was to give the students enough facts that they could then interpret and critically think about literature and the primary source materials. My testing was main…

it is also kind of silly that you need a college degree and a credential to teach elementary school. Shouldn't everyone be proficient enough at elementary school concepts when they graduate high school that they could then teach the basics to others? This is a really important issue to understand. Good teaching is difficult, even at the elementary level. Good teaching includes: - responding to each student's learning…

I agree that there is more to teaching than simply knowing and understanding the concepts. My overall message is more that credentialing is not the best way to train new teachers.

I'd also argue that credentialing is also used to limit the number of teachers entering the field to keep wages higher, but I suppose that is another matter entirely :)

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