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Tiny electric motor can produce more than 1,000 horsepower

supercarblondie.com

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Re: Tiny electric motor can produce more than 1,000 horsepower

#251

Post by Aurornis »

davedx wrote: post #6

Could lead to significant efficiency gains for EV's, because 1/4 of the motor weight means better power-to-weight ratio... a lot of things will automatically get better. YASA was founded in 2009, a spin out from Oxford University following the PhD of founder and still CTO, Dr Tim Woolmer. "Over the decades that followed both of these technologies were explored. But despite the potential for weight reduction, smaller…

> Could lead to significant efficiency gains for EV's, because 1/4 of the motor weight means better power-to-weight ratio... a lot of things will automatically get better.

EV motors are already lightweight. The electric motor in a vehicle like a Tesla Model 3 already weighs less than you do. Reducing that one component by 75% would be a weight savings equivalent to about a half of a passenger.

Not a significant efficiency improvement for vehicles that weigh over 3000lbs (or double that for many EVs).

Every little bit helps, but this isn’t a game changer.

Re: Tiny electric motor can produce more than 1,000 horsepower

#252

Post by rtaylorgarlock »

thenthenthen wrote: post #184
rtaylorgarlock wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

'Supercarblondie' manages to hit everything I dislike about automotive marketing online all at once.

Yeah wasnt blondie the name of a dog belonging to a certain historical figure?

Ha! I didn't know that. This blondie is definitely, definitely the more, um, traditional(?, oof) genus and species of American 'blondie' (no offense to blondes, I promise, as my disdain is in the direction of protection of blondes rather than broad criticism)

Re: Tiny electric motor can produce more than 1,000 horsepower

#253

Post by neya »

lunias wrote: post #198
davedx wrote: post #6

Could lead to significant efficiency gains for EV's, because 1/4 of the motor weight means better power-to-weight ratio... a lot of things will automatically get better. YASA was founded in 2009, a spin out from Oxford University following the PhD of founder and still CTO, Dr Tim Woolmer. "Over the decades that followed both of these technologies were explored. But despite the potential for weight reduction, smaller…

I wish more people on the road realized the extent to which weight reduction improves all aspects of the driving experience... it really does compound unlike any other change that you can make to a vehicle. IMO heavy vehicles are a scam and the antithesis of the direction we should be moving.

> I wish more people on the road realized the extent to which weight reduction improves all aspects of the driving experience

This is a blanket statement and completely untrue. Good driving experience is directly correlated to TRACTION, not just weight. And traction isn't just a function of weight - it also is affected by center of gravity, friction between the wheels and the road. Traction is what gives you the perception of being in control of the car.

I used to own two cars of the exact same model - one petrol and one diesel. The petrol is lighter in weight, about 100+ kgs lighter than the diesel variant. And the driving experience on that is slightly scary especially on roads with strong winds. In fact, it is so light that if you drive over tiny puddles or rumbles strips, the car will sway sideways. The diesel always feels more planted because it is front-heavy, thus adding more traction to the front wheels (both are FWDs). I always prefer the diesel for longer drives because of the heft and confidence it provides.

Re: Tiny electric motor can produce more than 1,000 horsepower

#254

Post by UnserMannInK »

thesz wrote: post #229
davedx wrote: post #6

Could lead to significant efficiency gains for EV's, because 1/4 of the motor weight means better power-to-weight ratio... a lot of things will automatically get better. YASA was founded in 2009, a spin out from Oxford University following the PhD of founder and still CTO, Dr Tim Woolmer. "Over the decades that followed both of these technologies were explored. But despite the potential for weight reduction, smaller…

Tesla Model Y's battery is 771 kg. The motor in Model Y weights about 45 kg, about three times as much as the motor in the article. By reducing dual motor configuration weight from 90 kg to 28 kg, we reduce total powertrain weight by 7%.

And shouldn’t it be possible to make the battery smaller with a more efficient motor?

Re: Tiny electric motor can produce more than 1,000 horsepower

#255

Post by jakogut »

rockostrich wrote: post #242
lunias wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish more people on the road realized the extent to which weight reduction improves all aspects of the driving experience... it really does compound unlike any other change that you can make to a vehicle. IMO heavy vehicles are a scam and the antithesis of the direction we should be moving.

Weight is not the only thing that matters though. You also need to consider center of gravity and wheel base. A YJ Jeep Wrangler and a Honda Fit both weigh around 2700 lbs and they even have similar wheel bases but the driving experience between those 2 is night and day. A Honda Fit can take a turn at speed without feeling like you're going to go flying. You'll feel like you're able to flip making a turn going 20 mph…

Lifting an off road vehicle isn't ironic at all, nearly every characteristic that makes a vehicle good on road makes it bad off road and vise versa.

Increased height makes for increased ground clearance and improved break over angle. Sway bars are another suspension component that's great for reducing body roll on road at speed, but reduces articulation and ground contact off road. Differential lockers also negatively impact turning radius, and cause tire chirp, wear, and oversteer under throttle on road, while increasing traction off road.

What's silly is daily driving an off road vehicle on road, especially if you never take it off road.

Re: Tiny electric motor can produce more than 1,000 horsepower

#256

Post by hvb2 »

rockostrich wrote: post #242
lunias wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish more people on the road realized the extent to which weight reduction improves all aspects of the driving experience... it really does compound unlike any other change that you can make to a vehicle. IMO heavy vehicles are a scam and the antithesis of the direction we should be moving.

Weight is not the only thing that matters though. You also need to consider center of gravity and wheel base. A YJ Jeep Wrangler and a Honda Fit both weigh around 2700 lbs and they even have similar wheel bases but the driving experience between those 2 is night and day. A Honda Fit can take a turn at speed without feeling like you're going to go flying. You'll feel like you're able to flip making a turn going 20 mph…

> Ironically, most people put lift kits on Jeeps but that also usually comes with widening the wheel base and putting on larger wheels/tires.

That's not ironic. That's just caring more about the looks and you like that look. And looks > handling for that person

Re: Tiny electric motor can produce more than 1,000 horsepower

#257

Post by I_dream_of_Geni »

lazide wrote: post #222
Tostino wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The first step to dealing with heat at high kw, is to not generate the heat you have to dissipate in the first place. Which means chasing smaller and smaller efficiency gains, because that reduces heat generated. The more of the energy going into moving the vehicle, the less heat the motor has to handle.

Sure, but at 50kw/kg at 99% efficiency is still 500w/kg, which is cray cray. Like ‘glowing red hot shortly’ type of crazy with just passive cooling. And there is no way this is 99% efficient. So my question still applies. Even 98% is 1kw/kg, or 1kj/sec. or around 3C rise per second assuming the mass is 100% nice clean copper (it isn’t). Everything else will be worse. Not even counting increasing losses with temperatu…

I was waiting to see in the comments EXACTLY this question: There is no way to dump this heat. 1000hp? Yeah, maybe for a few seconds, even with oil coolant pumping through there. Then how to dump the heat from the oil. And further thinking, if they ever get this to be a hub motor, how in the world are they going to pump coolant through 2-4 hub motors and then to a radiator that can dump that rate of heat rise, especially since oil is a lousy coolant (relatively speaking).

Re: Tiny electric motor can produce more than 1,000 horsepower

#258

Post by amluto »

This discussion is all about vehicles with large batteries, but how about hybrids? With light enough and efficient enough motors, all kinds of designs might become practical:

- Toyota-style hybrid drives could be a lot lighter, and they don’t need large batteries.

- e-bikes with tiny batteries?

- Hybrid aircraft? What if there was a battery large enough for takeoff and landing, a small motor (or pair for redundancy) for cruising and to recharge the battery, and motors and fans or propellers wherever is best from an aerodynamic perspective.

- Power tools.

Re: Tiny electric motor can produce more than 1,000 horsepower

#259

Post by dragontamer »

davedx wrote: post #6

Could lead to significant efficiency gains for EV's, because 1/4 of the motor weight means better power-to-weight ratio... a lot of things will automatically get better. YASA was founded in 2009, a spin out from Oxford University following the PhD of founder and still CTO, Dr Tim Woolmer. "Over the decades that followed both of these technologies were explored. But despite the potential for weight reduction, smaller…

Batteries are the bottleneck.

Even if motors were literally weightless and mass-less, EVs would weigh more than ICE cars.

It's like making a more efficient CPU for your phone when all the power is eaten up by the cell-modem, screen and RAM. People wonder where the practical battery life gains are and theyre miniscule in practice

Re: Tiny electric motor can produce more than 1,000 horsepower

#260

Post by hamdingers »

DrScientist wrote: post #157
amelius wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But EVs are already heavy because of the battery. I suppose percentage-wise the motors don't make much of a difference (?)

It compounds. If you have a lighter more efficient motor you need a smaller battery for the same range, that combined weight loss means you meed lighter brakes etc etc, and because the car is now lighter you size of your motor you need is less..... They claim, this compounding effect works out to basically double the effective weight saving from battery and motor. ie if you start with saving 50kg on motor, and 50kg o…

> If you have a lighter more efficient motor you need a smaller battery for the same range

Nitpick: You can have a lighter motor, but you're never going to have a significantly more efficient motor because existing EV motor systems are already 95% efficient or better. The electric motor is an old and refined technology.

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