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Formlabs: High Resolution 3D Printer

formlabs.com

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Re: Formlabs: High Resolution 3D Printer

#61

Post by regularfry »

tocomment wrote: post #18

So has the FDM process hit it's resolution limits in something like Makerbot or is there still room for improvement? (I'm curious which process to bet on)

With FDM, the fundamental limit (right now) is the viscosity and surface tension of the molten plastic. From memory, the Replicator 2 and the Ultimaker are hovering around that limit - you can make smaller motions with the print head, but the feature size you get won't really benefit.

With optical cure systems, in theory I think the limit is optical. In practice, there'll be unavoidable scattering at the focal point which will blur things a little, but I don't know exactly how much of a problem that is.

Re: Formlabs: High Resolution 3D Printer

#62

Post by regularfry »

tocomment wrote: post #44

It looks like it fills up a tray to do the print. Does it reuse what it doesn't solidify for future prints? (It would seem like a waste otherwise)

It looks to me like it fills up enough to do a few layers, then refills, so any wastage should be minimal.

Re: Formlabs: High Resolution 3D Printer

#63

Post by palebluedot »

cottonseed wrote: post #10

Can an expert in 3D printing compare this with, say, the MakerBot Replicator 2? How does the extruder technology compare with SL on resolution, hardness, speed of printing, etc?

I've seen some answers to your questions with regards to resolution, etc., but none to the part that is of interest to me: how does the PLA/ABS plastic of the Replicator 2/2X compare to the SLA, once printed, in terms of durability?

I've had SLA models professionally made, and they came with a warning to handle them gently, because they were brittle and not very strong (and, they were expensive).

Does anyone know, if you were to use the Form 1 for something like hobby robotics (i.e., outside of just design prototyping, but as a printer for parts), would it hold up well?

Re: Formlabs: High Resolution 3D Printer

#64

Post by regularfry »

tisme wrote: post #56
replicatorblog wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep - My company bought a $50K printer 6 years ago - this one is much better performance wise. The annual service contract for that one is $10K, so I could burn through a Form 1 per quarter and come out ahead. This will change product development the way CMSs changed publishing.

You've been telling people to hold off buying a 3D printer from other manufacturers until this one was unveiled. But I don't get the impression this is in the product phase yet. There are some slick pictures and a nice presentation but nothing at all that indicates the thing actually exists in an about to ship state. What exactly is the state of development of the formlabs product?

If it's not in the product phase, it's one hell of a prototype. Just from the video, they've got custom PCBs built, a custom case, and a whole shelf full of older prototypes.

Re: Formlabs: High Resolution 3D Printer

#66

Post by tisme »

regularfry wrote: post #64
tisme wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You've been telling people to hold off buying a 3D printer from other manufacturers until this one was unveiled. But I don't get the impression this is in the product phase yet. There are some slick pictures and a nice presentation but nothing at all that indicates the thing actually exists in an about to ship state. What exactly is the state of development of the formlabs product?

If it's not in the product phase, it's one hell of a prototype. Just from the video, they've got custom PCBs built, a custom case, and a whole shelf full of older prototypes.

From prototype to product is a (sometimes very) long road, I find it a bit strange that someone would say 'don't buy 'x' where 'x' is available today because there exists a prototype from a company that has not yet shipped in volume.

Maybe my expectations were not realistic but I expected something a lot closer to production. Tons of things that are prototyped never make it to production or end up costing substantially more than envisioned at the prototype stage and I'm pretty wary of pre-ordering things that are not yet in the production pipeline. Pre-ordering is great if you've ramped up to volume production and items are about to be shipped. Pre-order money should go the BOM of the device that will be shipped to you, to shipping, warranty issues and assembly, not to process/product development. See 'wakemate'.

Re: Formlabs: High Resolution 3D Printer

#67

Post by tocomment »

tocomment wrote: post #65

I think it would be cool if future models included a FDM head too. That way you could build in circuits or use ABS as a cheap filler.

After watching the video that may not be feasible. It looks like it's building the model top down, so extruded plastic would just fall? I was picturing it building from the bottom up so extruded plastic could rest on the previous layer.

Is there a chance that conductive resin could be used in the future for circuits?

Re: Formlabs: High Resolution 3D Printer

#68

Post by silasb »

tibbon wrote: post #14
cottonseed wrote: post #10

Can an expert in 3D printing compare this with, say, the MakerBot Replicator 2? How does the extruder technology compare with SL on resolution, hardness, speed of printing, etc?

Lithography printing from what I've seen so far is significantly better than extruder tech. We have a Projet 1500 and an original Makerbot at my hackerspace (Columbus Idea Foundry). The Projet absolutely kills the makerbot for resolution and jitter. If you made a sphere on the projet, it will be pretty damn smooth. On the Makerbot (original) it will have a strong texture to it. No experience with Replicator 2. Yet, i…

I've been putting off going to Columbus Idea Foundry, but with all the cool tech there I might just have to get my membership.

Re: Formlabs: High Resolution 3D Printer

#69

Post by jws »

mibbitier wrote: post #36
jws wrote: post #2

The call to action link says: "Pre-Order on Kickstarter" They must have not gotten the "Kickstarter is not a store" memo. They appear to be ready to pull the trigger on their manufacturing partners, so this is sort of a "how big should we make the first run?" type of kickstarter rather than a "let's create something awesome". Details… • Stereolithography printer (laser, not extruder) • Much nicer than extruder style…

First thing I noticed as well. "pre-Order on kickstarter" screams out "This is a scam!!!! You'll never get anything". I've never understood why anyone would give anything via kickstarter. A "donate now" paypal button would probably be less scammy.

Fully funded in under 12 hours. 708 hours to go.

For something that is ready to enter manufacturing I think a pre-order model is appropriate. I'd be alarmed if someone used those words on an idea or something in the middle of the prototyping process.

A "donate now" button for a commercial venture is an instant and permanent red flag for me.

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