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Apple loses German patent court case

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Apple loses German patent court case

#31

Post by cooldeal »

deelowe wrote: post #26
cooldeal wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sigh, this whole Android is open or not argument is degenerating into the kind of arguments over 'Copyright infringement vs. Stealing'. Here's one good solution, call the open Android as Androidium(on the lines of Chrome vs. Chromium). Very good article on the openness of Android and to implement the above proposal. http://marketingland.com/what-is-the-one-true-android-and-ho... >Some like to claim that since Google…

I like the androidium idea. It would help with the confusion. The acer problem is an interesting thing to examine closer. The issue is that of android fragmentation. Vendors want to ship hardware asap (to their own detriment at times). Google is more interested in the long term viability of the OS. I think the acer threat is a good thing. It's good that Google maintains this leverage. Otherwise, android will fragment…

I agree with what you said about Google doing these things for the good of the Android ecosystem, but the problem is with calling Android "open". There are a lot of caveats to that statement which almost always go unmentioned by the person calling it open.

Re: Apple loses German patent court case

#32

Post by pooriaazimi »

bryanlarsen wrote: post #30
cooldeal wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sigh, this whole Android is open or not argument is degenerating into the kind of arguments over 'Copyright infringement vs. Stealing'. Here's one good solution, call the open Android as Androidium(on the lines of Chrome vs. Chromium). Very good article on the openness of Android and to implement the above proposal. http://marketingland.com/what-is-the-one-true-android-and-ho... >Some like to claim that since Google…

What's the difference between "Androidium" and AOSP?

It's cooler, and kinda rhymes with Chromium (which is to Chrome what Androidium will be to Android).

Re: Apple loses German patent court case

#33

Post by alayne »

w1ntermute wrote: post #17
kgarten wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately, Android is not really open source :( Edit: If you think this statement is not true, please look at Debian or any other REAL open source project compare it to Android. Android uses Open-Source as a marketing term, not in it's original meaning ... (or at least in how I understand open source)

> Android uses Open-Source as a marketing term Oh really? https://twitter.com/Arubin/status/27808662429

Dumping your source code into a repository after release may technically be open source, but it isn't in the spirit of community developed open source.

Re: Apple loses German patent court case

#34

Post by Tichy »

cooldeal wrote: post #29
Tichy wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are possible because Android is open source. Edit: overlooked that you already mentioned them. The argument "nobody uses them without Play and Maps" is invalid, though.

>The argument "nobody uses them without Play and Maps" is invalid, though. Why? CM is legally prohibited from bundling Play Store, Google apps like Mail, Youtube, Maps, Currents, Now etc. etc. In fact, Google sent them a C&D for doing so. http://phandroid.com/2009/09/25/cyanogen-gets-cd-from-google... If users cannot obtain them from (sometimes shady) filesharing sites, how many using CM currently would have installe…

Still, the OS is open source, even if some of the apps are not. Number of installs is not a relevant metric for open sourceness.

Re: Apple loses German patent court case

#35

Post by rimantas »

w1ntermute wrote: post #17
kgarten wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately, Android is not really open source :( Edit: If you think this statement is not true, please look at Debian or any other REAL open source project compare it to Android. Android uses Open-Source as a marketing term, not in it's original meaning ... (or at least in how I understand open source)

> Android uses Open-Source as a marketing term Oh really? https://twitter.com/Arubin/status/27808662429

Have you tried that? What have you got? There is some interesting thinking there going on. Apple releases lame maps and everyone goes "Android is superior there", but when you cannot get for the source of this app for android then we get "Maps are not really Android".

Re: Apple loses German patent court case

#36

Post by cooldeal »

bryanlarsen wrote: post #30
cooldeal wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sigh, this whole Android is open or not argument is degenerating into the kind of arguments over 'Copyright infringement vs. Stealing'. Here's one good solution, call the open Android as Androidium(on the lines of Chrome vs. Chromium). Very good article on the openness of Android and to implement the above proposal. http://marketingland.com/what-is-the-one-true-android-and-ho... >Some like to claim that since Google…

What's the difference between "Androidium" and AOSP?

There's probably no difference technically, but you don't see people using that term much. For example, in this thread we see people saying Android is open, instead of AOSP is open.

Perhaps increasing the usage of the AOSP term will suffice.

Re: Apple loses German patent court case

#37

Post by cooldeal »

Tichy wrote: post #34
cooldeal wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The argument "nobody uses them without Play and Maps" is invalid, though. Why? CM is legally prohibited from bundling Play Store, Google apps like Mail, Youtube, Maps, Currents, Now etc. etc. In fact, Google sent them a C&D for doing so. http://phandroid.com/2009/09/25/cyanogen-gets-cd-from-google... If users cannot obtain them from (sometimes shady) filesharing sites, how many using CM currently would have installe…

Still, the OS is open source, even if some of the apps are not. Number of installs is not a relevant metric for open sourceness.

The OP I was replying to said that projects like CM won't be popular if Android wasn't open source.

I replied that CM's popularity is a direct result of people committing copyright infringement by providing and downloading non-open source Google apps. Won't cutting that off reduce the popularity of CM?

AOSP is open. Android? Probably not so much, since it includes the Play Store and Google Apps in common usage of the term. Don't you see the technical distinction between Android and AOSP?

Re: Apple loses German patent court case

#39

Post by xentronium »

fluidcruft wrote: post #28
xentronium wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are already exerting control over what their vendors can and can't do. See asus aliyun debacle.

That's a pretty extreme example and really more of a Google vs carrier battle than a Google vs Asus battle. Aliyun was trying to establish a Play competitor and lock Google out--you can't expect Google to play along. Since Honeycomb Google's been pretty strong relative to manufacturers. The biggest pre-Honeycomb threat was Motorola that was thrashing to cut Google out and get back in control (Skyhook, BlurOS) and...…

> but access to the Platform Development Kit and possibly unannounced Nexus projects--i.e. access to the pre-Open Source drops

As far as I understand, it also meant access to all google services for all acer (not asus, my mistake) smartphones. So it's an ultimatum after all.

Re: Apple loses German patent court case

#40

Post by kondor6c »

kgarten wrote: post #16
neya wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really? The last time I checked I was able to download the source code and do something with it on my own. Could you please justify your statement?

For me open source means something else. Maemo was a real open source platform. Android is not: 1. You can download part of the source (part is closed). 2. The source you can download and compile does not run on any phone (without some binaries). 3. Can you please send me the svn link to the newest pre-release version of Android (newer then Jelly Bean)? So as a recap you can download part of the OS as source code. Th…

I don't think a downvote is necessary :)

It seems as though you're coming down on Android pretty hard. On my laptop I can't get my Broadcom wireless card to work without binaries. I also can't get my NVIDIA graphics card working either. Is that the fault of Debian? Does that make Debian any less open? It's more the fault of the hardware provider. I don't think that Android takes away from Debian at all. I think the open-ness lies in the licensing. For example, is qmail open source?

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